Richard's Soaps! Settling into a groove...

[Richard Perrine]

Hi all. Two months into soap-making and learned tons and learning more each day. How exactly do regular bar soaps differ from shampoo bars?

Just wanted to share some of my soaps. Still trying to be more adventurous with my presentation and design, but feeling really good about my formulations, including transparent soaps. I will be embarking in the dreaded world of swirling, etc. soon, but wanted muster up enough courage before diving in.

Here are some samples...

 

[ulrurunaturals]

I'd like to know about how shampoo bars differ from regular soap bars. I believe it's in the formulation and possible finished pH I don't know however I am Interested to find out. I'll be watching this thread w interest. Good luck in your soaping adventure.

 

[dixiedragon]

If you dig around, you'll see some recipes for CP soap shampoo bars. However, since those were posted, forum opinion has shifted. Soap is bad for hair. Some bars are made from synthetics - detergents, etc. Which are much better for hair!

 

[DeeAnna]

We go round and round on this "shampoo bar" issue on a regular basis. A search will bring up plenty of threads on this topic, and I think it's a good thing to learn the wide variety of opinions on that matter.

If you are thinking of a "shampoo bar" as being a bar of soap made using lye, then shampoo bars aren't necessarily a whole lot different than a regular bath bar, except for what you call it on the label. Some people use less or no coconut or palm oil for mild cleansing. Some people use more castor oil than the usual 5% or they use more specialty fats such as avocado or argan. I don't see people using a lot of solid additives in their soap-based shampoo bars -- who wants to be rinsing out bits of this 'n that out of their hair? The thread "Thanks Ginny" or "Thanks Lindy" (or something close to that) has a recipe that many people like for shampoo bars and for a mild bath and facial soap.

If you are thinking of a "shampoo bar" as being a blend of synthetic detergents in a solid bar form, then there is less information on this forum about that, but Susan at Swift Crafty Monkey, the Ponte Vedra soap website, and others all have good information about syndet shampoo bars.

Regardless of what kind of bar you have in mind, you also need to understand is there is a big disagreement, often civil but sometimes acrimonious, between those who swear by lye-soap shampoo bars and those who swear by syndet shampoo bars. Some of us have used soap shampoo bars and found to our sorrow that our hair was eventually badly damaged by washing with lye-based soap. Syndets are our cleanser of choice for hair. Others enjoy using soap to clean their hair and have good results. Some in this group are also philosophically opposed to using "non crunchy" syndets.

It's good to be clear about what type of "shampoo bar" you're talking about. While both types get hair clean, they are totally different in how they're made and how they function ... and the groups to whom they appeal.

 

[lsg]

Richard, it looks like you are having fun experimenting with colors and layering. I make liquid shampoo for my family using surfactants. Susan Swift has great information on formulating shampoo.

 

[Richard Perrine]

Thank you all. Thank you Deanna. I was curious as to what exactly the difference would be in regular and shampoo 'lye-based' soap bars. I looked at recipes and found them to be all over the place. Some making me shake my head and saying, 'Well, this looks like a hard bar recipe.' Still a little confused. I will shy away from it. I use my bar soaps for my hair and I do not find that my hair is any worse for it. It could be that my soaps are already 'nourishing.' I'll start claiming that my soaps are 'Total body' soaps (body & hair).

@lsg. Having a great time, but only tried layering once. My hp Tea Tree Menthol bars and that was my 2nd or 3rd soap I ever made. The bars that have two colors are actually two 'side by side' pours of two different soap types. One is cinnamon + jasmine while the other is cacao + aloe vera mint. They smell heavenly.

 

[DeeAnna]

I agree that there's no consensus about what defines a soap-based bar as a "shampoo bar", other than someone decides to call it that. I truly don't.

I think there's a lot more consensus about what a decent shave soap is, even though shave soap making dudes and dudettes often disagree on the fine details.

 

[CaraBou]

Welcome Richard. By the looks of your pics, you’re off to a good start. There’s no dread in swirls, just trial, error and patience

 

[ulrurunaturals]

Welcome Richard. By the looks of your pics, you’re off to a good start. There’s no dread in swirls, just trial, error and patience

Yes I have been soaping since Aug 2017. I haven't experimented with swirls or diliberate two tones I sorts let my soap take a life of it's own and accept the unexpected end product. That's all apart of the journey as well. Cause the more you try to control out comes the more dossappointed and discouraged you'll become. It's just life you got to roll with it

 

[Richard Perrine]

I have been experimenting with replacing my water with other liquids. I loathe using food in my soap, but juices, I will try sparingly. I have tried OJ, Grapefruit juice, coconut water, coffee and aloe vera. I have no problems with tracing with any of these. All of them seem to impart their colors, but aloe vera (not fresh or raw) definitely does more for the bar (nice scent, but does cure with no color). Grapefruit juice resembles OJ and gives a nice orange color. Both juices also produce an ugly odor when the lye is added, but dissipates after some time curing. I have been using the pink juice, so maybe the clearer juice will not impart that orange color? I have two bars below of coconut scented. One contains water and the other coconut water with a label claim of 1% sugars. The water was clear when poured, but after adding the NaOH, it turned yellow. Phenols and/or caramelized sugars?

 

[dndlyon]

I sorts let my soap take a life of it's own and accept the unexpected end product. That's all apart of the journey as well. Cause the more you try to control out comes the more dossappointed and discouraged you'll become. It's just life you got to roll with it

@ulrurunaturals - Love this! This is my experience as well. I design a great image on paper and it always turns out good, but never turns out to match the paper

 

[dixiedragon]

I use my bar soaps for my hair and I do not find that my hair is any worse for it. It could be that my soaps are already 'nourishing.' I'll start claiming that my soaps are 'Total body' soaps (body & hair).

@lsg.

Assuming your profile pic is you, I think it's fine for people with short hair to use soap on their hair. The issue comes when you have long hair. Hair is dead, so if you want long hair, you have to care for it because damage builds up. Several long-haired posters here used soap for a while (months or more), liked it a lot - and then the damage started to show. I think one poster said she had to cut off more than a foot of hair. That is years and years of hair growth, and if you like your long hair, it makes you want to cry!

 

[ulrurunaturals]

@ulrurunaturals - Love this! This is my experience as well. I design a great image on paper and it always turns out good, but never turns out to match the paper

Well it's good to let the things go you can't control...otherwise the hobby turns into a burden

 

[Richard Perrine]

Yup. Me with short hair. I agree. No issues with short hair.

I like to have control in the process, fortunately or unfortunately.

 

[KimT2au]

Hi Richard, I think this is the link DeAnna mentioned. It got me curious so I had to go look; https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/excited-gennys-shampoo-bar-made-3-versions.55276/

Kim

 

[Richard Perrine]

Watched another video using coconut water

Hi Richard, I think this is the link DeAnna mentioned. It got me curious so I had to go look; https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/excited-gennys-shampoo-bar-made-3-versions.55276/

Kim

Kim,

Thank you and I did look at it and I am still not convinced that the discussion at that thread is nothing more than 'soap.' I have been using my soaps and my hair is clean and not dry. But, with my short hair, maybe it doesn't matter.

 

[iNaturalBody]

Hey Richard!
Great topic of discussion. I have been soaping for many years. I find that my bars that I deam luxury (Shea,coconut,Argan,jojoba, etc.)...they may utilize 3 or 4 of the mentioned products, though I market them as all natural Body soap and safe for hair, I do advise my clients that in the event this bar is strictly for hair use (because handcrafted soap can be quite conditioning), to do a apple cider vinegar rinse (1 part acv/4 parts distilled water) to remove the build up that lye soap can deposit in the hair shaft over time.
Now, this works for me. I have a loose curl pattern on about 19 inches of hair. Over time, the hair curl pattern changes; I can factually say that this has contributed to the length and retention of my hair (and my 8 year old’s hair also). Also, the acv is part of a hair regimen, just like my choice of “shampoo” is a part of a regimen. There are other things that I do throughout the month to care for my hair. Total hair care is more than shampoo. My clients appreciate that I can add a healthier alternative to cleansing their and their families hair while arming them with information they can research or test on a small section of their own hair before committing to a shampoo bar (if necessary, for their specific hair type). I believe this is key! Good luck with your endeavors! Love your work!

 

[Angelique]

Thanks for your feedback
I think that if people want to go back doing their hair natural and on a more eco friendly way with bars
They have to learn to do a little bit extra in taking care of it
Instead of the bottled champoo made in a lab with all kinds of e-numbers ans such in it...we are used of washing-rinsing-done
I know that people with your hairstyle are used spending time at taking good care of your locks
My bf is from Curacao and ideed cutting hair of is a shame if it took so long to grow
Maby it is up to us to make some (extra) products so we can make it work

View attachment 32160 Hey Richard!
Great topic of discussion. I have been soaping for many years. I find that my bars that I deam luxury (Shea,coconut,Argan,jojoba, etc.)...they may utilize 3 or 4 of the mentioned products, though I market them as all natural Body soap and safe for hair, I do advise my clients that in the event this bar is strictly for hair use (because handcrafted soap can be quite conditioning), to do a apple cider vinegar rinse (1 part acv/4 parts distilled water) to remove the build up that lye soap can deposit in the hair shaft over time.
Now, this works for me. I have a loose curl pattern on about 19 inches of hair. Over time, the hair curl pattern changes; I can factually say that this has contributed to the length and retention of my hair (and my 8 year old’s hair also). Also, the acv is part of a hair regimen, just like my choice of “shampoo” is a part of a regimen. There are other things that I do throughout the month to care for my hair. Total hair care is more than shampoo. My clients appreciate that I can add a healthier alternative to cleansing their and their families hair while arming them with information they can research or test on a small section of their own hair before committing to a shampoo bar (if necessary, for their specific hair type). I believe this is key! Good luck with your endeavors! Love your work!

 

[KimT2au]

@Richard Perrine , I remember a while ago that you put up a photo of a wine soap you made. What type of wine did you use?

Kim

 

[Richard Perrine]

Hi Kim. I used the sweetest red Moscato I could find. Barefoot Red Moscato. I must warn you that I continue to experiment with this. It turns out that the integrity of the soap becomes compromised and the nice wine odor does not last. I need to further test and investigate. The key is to minimize the wine with the lye. I have some ideas and will test later.