Question about Mystic Moments Cocamidopropyl betaine

[TC472]

Evening all,

My body wash recipe I've been using for quite a while is;

163ml Stephensons premium hair & body wash
7ml scent
3 drops colour
100ml Cocamidopropyl betaine

Now my latest purchase of the Mystic Moments Cocamidopropyl betaine has left my body wash looking like tap water. Really frustrating after all this time.

My question is. Has anyone had a similar experience using this from this supplier?

Thanks folks

 

[Juggsy]

Firstly, usually in personal care - we use grams as opposed to volume measurements as grams are easy to convert to a working formula (cosmetic formulas are always in %)

I've never used Stephenson premade things but the inci for it is :
Lauryl Glucoside, Sodium Lauroyl Isethionate, Polyquaternium-7, Sodium Chloride, Lauric Acid, Sodium Benzoate, Trisodium Ethylenediamine Disuccinate, Phenoxyethanol, Citric Acid, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Sodium Methyl Isethionate, Sodium Laurate, Sodium Lauroyl Methyl Isethionate


This means that it already has CAPB (cocomidopropyl betaine) and it's not necessary to add more unless adding a small percentage to thicken formula.

in fact, a quick search for this product says that it should be used as is. The only thing you need to add is up to 1% fragrance. Without adding more solubiliser, it's recommended you only add up to 0.5% (according to the tech documents)

I think what's happened is when you've added more CAPB you have thinned your viscosity. CAPB actually helps to thicken surfactant systems (& adding a small amount will help thicken this base, looking at ingredients in base) but if you add too much it will actually thin out your product and go cloudy.

 

[DeeAnna]

Products can and do vary a bit and still be within their allowed tolerances. So just because this particular formulation has worked fine in the past doesn't necessarily mean it will always work as expected.

CAPB can thicken a detergent blend, but if too much is added, it will paradoxically thin the blend. Also fragrances can thin or thicken a detergent blend depending on the chemicals in the fragrance. If you used a different fragrance or if your current fragrance was refomulated, the fragrance can also give unexpected results.

Not sure why you're adding so much CAPB to a pre-made cleanser, but that's your call. You'll need to verify how the fragrance affects the blend and also do a "salt curve" to see what the optimum amount of CAPB is now required to provide the desired results.

 

[justjacqui]

CAPB is generally around 30% active surfactant but it also contains sodium chloride (salt). The salt level can vary by supplier. So this is probably why you are now having issues when changing suppliers.

Salt can help to thicken some surfactant systems up to a certain level but above that level the solution thins out. This behavior is generally called a salt curve. The salt curve is dependent on both the type and amount of surfactants (and other ingredients) in your system.

This link may help your understanding https://www.researchgate.net/publication/333324616_Understanding_Salt_Curves

As DeeAnna has mentioned you will need to work out the amount of CAPB that can be added to your system now that you are using new CAPB. Or just change back to your previous supplier.

Also double check that your Stephenson's base formula hasn't changed.

Hope this helps

 

[persephonesgarden]

WSP markets CAPB as a secondary foaming agent to add extra foam/lather to body washes and bubble baths, that would be my guess as to why they are adding more on top of the base.