New to Soap Making Question

[ScottN]

I’m new to soap making and have a question: I would like to reproduce something similar to Williams shaving soap which is tallow based. I found a tallow based soap flake that has almost identical ingredients to the Williams shaving soap with the exception of a few ingredients such as: potassium stearate, glycerin, fragrance, stearic acid, and tetra sodium etidronate.

Can I add these additional ingredients to the tallow soap flakes in a “melt and pour” process? Would this work?

I appreciate any experienced opinions.

 

[AliOop]

Hello @ScottN, and welcome to soapmaking. Without knowing the exact ingredients of the tallow soap flakes, nor the ingredients of the specific Williams soap you are trying to dupe, any answers we give would have to be wild guesses. If you can share both of those things in full detail, we may be able to assist.

However, it's not all that easy to add any significant quantity of additional ingredients to an already-made soap such as your tallow soap flakes.

Is there a reason you don't want to create your own shaving soap using just the ingredients from the Williams shaving soap, including some KOH and NaOH?

 

[ScottN]

First of all, AliOop, thank you for your reply. And, in answer to your question about why I don’t create my own shaving soap from scratch, well, I certainly would like to as I’ve always (for many years- and I’m 64) wanted to try making my own soap(s). But… I admit, it’s truly a bit intimidating! I know it’s probably easier than I think, just a matter of taking that first step. And that is why I asked about proceeding with this project using some sort of melt and pour process. Just seemed like an easy way to ease into the hobby without too much commitment, that is, though, if it would work.

So, the shaving soap ingredients per the packaging is:

Potassium Stearate
Sodium Tallowate
Sodium Cocoate
Water
Glycerin
Fragrance
Sodium Chloride
Titanium Dioxide
Stearic Acid
Pentasodium Pentatate
Tetrasodium Etidronate

(my understanding is that an older, and allegedly better, formulation of this shaving soap listed Tallow as the first ingredient)

The ingredients for the Tallow soap flakes is:

Sodium Tallowate
Sodium Cocoate
Water
Glycerin
Sodium Chloride
Pentasodium Pentetate

So, based on this info, do you think that it’s possible to turn the Tallow soap flake into the shaving soap by adding additional ingredients ? Or is it a fool’s errand, and I should just “Bite the bullet” and start from scratch?

 

[KiwiMoose]

Hiya @ScottN

Stearic acid is one of the key ingredients in a shave soap. It can't really be added to melt and pour soap. It will need to be saponified. Any items that have the words 'sodium' or 'potassium' in front of them in your ingredients list are saponified ( i.e. mixed with lye) forms of the ingredient that follows the word - tallowate is tallow, cocoate is coconut and stearate is stearic acid.

I say bite the bullet! You will need to learn the hot process method if you want to make shave soap.
Make it! You'll love it and become addicted like we all have!

 

[Ford]

The working temps of some of the ingredients. Are high enough. That I use a crockpot now. Kept having to pop it back in micro wave on my first attempt. Good luck.

 

[dibbles]

I don’t make shave soap, so I’m not able to give you any advice about that. But I will say that it took me a long time to finally get over my fears of working with the lye. Once I did it a few times I was comfortable with the process. Just remember that thousands of people do it every day and you are just as capable as they are.

 

[TheGecko]

So, based on this info, do you think that it’s possible to turn the Tallow soap flake into the shaving soap by adding additional ingredients ? Or is it a fool’s errand, and I should just “Bite the bullet” and start from scratch?

Given the amount of work required, you might as well make it from scratch. And someone who has quite a number of videos on the subject as well as a recipe is Ellen Ruth Soap.

 

[AliOop]

If you are up for buying a book, this one is a great resource for how to make shaving soap, including recipes and the overall process. If you prefer free online resources, the YT channel mentioned by @TheGecko above is a good one. Here is another one.

 

[ScottN]

If you are up for buying a book, this one is a great resource for how to make shaving soap, including recipes and the overall process. If you prefer free online resources, the YT channel mentioned by @TheGecko above is a good one. Here is another one.

Funny, I just watched that last YouTube video the day before I found this forum. And, I’m all about buying useful books! Thank you

 

[AliOop]

I would encourage you to give it a try! Dual-lye shave soaps aren't the simplest place to start as a beginning soapmaker, but if that's what interests you, it's not rocket science, either. Make small batches to start - 500g or so - or you will end up with more shave soap than you can use in a lifetime. Don't ask me how I know.

 

[Zany_in_CO]

in answer to your question about why I don’t create my own shaving soap from scratch, well, I certainly would like to as I’ve always (for many years- and I’m 64) wanted to try making my own soap(s). But… I admit, it’s truly a bit intimidating!

Not to worry. I made my first soap in 2003 at age 60. To this day, it brings me joy. I started out on a quest to create soap that didn't irritate my skin. To this day, I soap to maintain my sanity and because it's cheaper than therapy.

 

[Shelley D]

I don’t make shave soap, so I’m not able to give you any advice about that. But I will say that it took me a long time to finally get over my fears of working with the lye. Once I did it a few times I was comfortable with the process. Just remember that thousands of people do it every day and you are just as capable as they are.

I second that! I anguished over working with lye for years until I finally just did it. Should have done it all those years ago! It's not as bad as you might think. Just be sure to research the method you plan to use ~ search for videos on making shaving soap specifically so you see the process, and watch as many videos as you can find. Plus, search this forum for all the information available! It's a gold mine for sure!
Happy soaping!

 

[ScottN]

I appreciate all of the feedback, suggestions and support! Thank you all. So, if I can impose just a bit more… what is the least expensive way to get started? I see that some use electric crockpots, some microwave ovens, other’s stainless pans on a stove top. All of which I assume are solely dedicated for soap making. And all of the raw ingredients seem availability through that online bookstore that sells everything. As far as alkalis, is it best to go with products specifically sold for soap making? I remember years ago reading that powdered drain cleaner (lye) could be used, as well as boiled fireplace ashes ( I think that is from my old Firefox books).

 

[Zany_in_CO]

what is the least expensive way to get started?

Lard Soap ingredients are not only readily available, but it makes darn good soap as well. You can buy lard (Manteca, Armour, etc) and distilled water at the grocery store. Lye can indeed be purchased as "drain cleaner" at Lowe's, Home Depot, Ace Hardware, Target and Walmart. Just be sure you're buying 100% Sodium Hydroxide crystals (NaOH).

Spend some time getting comfortable with an online calculator. SoapCalc is the most widely used one. Follow the directions written in Red at the top of the first page. Enter recipes that interest you to see how it all comes together. Once you understand the basics, you will be able to manipulate it to create the soap of your dreams.

My first time: Dressed in full "hazmat" (safety) gear, standing out in my open garage, with fear and trepidation, I added my lye solution to my heated lard, stirred with a $10 stick blender from Target and VOILA! I made soap! I poured it into a quart size milk carton. Unmolded and cut the next day. Honestly? I heaved a sigh of relief and never looked back!

For me, the journey began with a book I found in the discount bin at Barnes & Noble.
For you, I suggest you begin by setting a solid foundation by downloading and reading:

Find answers to most of your questions about start-up here:

https://www.soapmakingforum.com/threads/beginners-learn-to-soap-online.64426/#post-657018
HAPPY SOAPING!

 

[TheGecko]

I see that some use electric crockpots, some microwave ovens, other’s stainless pans on a stove top.

I would go with an electric crockpot; you can probably find them fairly cheap at local thrift shops.

All of which I assume are solely dedicated for soap making.

Yes and no. I was of the opinion when I first started soaping making that I wouldn't be able to reuse the stuff I use for it with cooking, but that's not totally true. Now I wouldn't reuse plastic, but stainless steel, glass or ceramic would be okay. But with that said I have dedicated soap making equipment so it's always available when I go to make soap. So if I were to do Hot Process Soap, I would have a separate crockpot/slow cooker that I bought from a local thrift shop.

And all of the raw ingredients seem availability through that online bookstore that sells everything. As far as alkalis, is it best to go with products specifically sold for soap making? I remember years ago reading that powdered drain cleaner (lye) could be used, as well as boiled fireplace ashes ( I think that is from my old Firefox books).

Yes and no. A lot of use supplies that we can get locally, including Sodium Hydroxide. You just need to double/triple-check the ingredients label and make sure that what you have is 100% of what you are expecting. And unless you are in a SHTF situation, I wouldn't use boiled fireplace ashes unless you are just wanting to play around. One of my grandmothers made soap that way back in the Ozarks, but it wasn't something that we bathed with...she'd use for laundry or doing dishes (with gloves).

 

[KiwiMoose]

And remember not to use anything made of aluminium with your soap making - lye and aluminium are not friends.