Need help with a Hemp recipe

[SoapyGal]

Hi guys

I've been spending alot of time trying to configure a recipe to use up the rest of a 4-oz. bottle of Hemp that I have in the fridge. It's almost a month old now, & I'd like to use it up before it goes rancid (supposed to be ok in fridge for 2 mos.)

I don't want to use coconut oil or PKO because I appear to be hyper-sensitive to Lauric Acid.

I'm confusing myself bigtime & figured I better turn to the pros & see if I can untangle myself from this mess I've created for myself.

The fats/oils I have to work with are:

* Lard
* Olive
* Hemp
* Palm
* Shea
* Castor
* Crisco

I've tried a bazillion combinations of all of them, and to tell you the truth, the *numbers* on the soap calc are throwing me for a loop. When I put something together that I think sounds "good", the *numbers* show outside of the "desired parameters" :roll: I don't trust my instincts at all, because I'm very new to soapmaking still.

I wanted to use as high an amount as possible of Hemp -- without getting the DOS -- so that I can truly get a feel for that oil in a soap. I'm thinking 20-25% -- :?: :!:

It's been suggested to me to use only lard & keep out the crisco, since they're very similar. Lard is the favorite.

I understand that I shouldn't use castor or shea at a higher amount than 5%...

Does anyone have any input to help me put together a recipe for this?

I appreciate any assistance you can provide.

Thanks!

Michele

 

[Guest]

Soapy I was thinking about your problem and even wrote a reply to this thread, but I got distracted before posting and I accidentally deleted it...

Here's the gist:

You are going to have some deficiencies if you have no CO/PKO/babassu although those may be the cause of your skin problems. Recognize that any advice I have to offer will be an unbalanced recipe and low on cleansing, although maybe low on cleansing is what you skin needs (cleansing removes natural oils and could be a problem). The lauric problem.

Try this recipe in SoapCalc and I'll try to help you again tomorrow. I was tinkering with SoapCalc and trying to avoid lauric and this is what I came up with:

lard 16 oz
hemp 4 oz
castor 4 oz

I admit it's an unbalanced recipe but it's the best I could come up with short notice. Feed me back and I'll try to help you more tomorrow. 4 oz isn't much to work with.

Don't believe that 5 percent stuff on castor. I routinely use 10% and Hempster's Haven recipe uses 30%. You can have lots of castor, and in fact I count castor as one of my holy trinity: CO, PO, castor. Add a soft oil and you can't go wrong.

 

[Guest]

Oh and I particularly didn't want to reply at the other place although I saw your thread there. I hope you get better advice here, and I'll do my best to make it so.

 

[SoapyGal]

Thanks for your reply, Greg.

I'm trying to reach as many soapers as possible, so figured that was the best way

I certainly don't know what I'm doing, & still need hand holding, unfortunately.

Maybe I shouldn't mess with hemp at all until I know more about the soapmaking process. The main reason I bought it is because of the great things I've read about it, about it's ability to regenerate new cell growth, etc. I have some serious skin problems that I won't go into right now, so my main purpose for learning to make soap, is to make a product for myself that my body doesn't consider toxic!

At first I thought it was the detergent in the commercial soaps that was aggravating my issues, but after being exposed to homemade soap with & without Lauric Acid, I now know that's an issue as well.

Maybe the hemp would do me better in a lotion, or a leave-on product.

I dunno <shug>

But, I'll play with your recipe on soap calc.

I thought to include shea, because I know that it will make a hard bar, & also has unsaponifiables in it that are very healing. When I use it straight on my skin, I have great results with it. But I've read that using more than 5-10% can cause skin to become very unhappy, also. All things in moderation, I guess.

I thought to use olive oil in the concoction, because eventually it makes for a hard bar of soap.

It's the whole *synergy* thing that's got me confused. I know there's a *right* way to concoct a recipe, and a wrong way. I know that I'm not supposed to just throw a pinch of this & a dash of that into the mix just because it sounds good, the way you can do in cooking.

I never took chemistry in school, so that's no help to me!

I'm now wondering if I should go out & purchase canola, or safflower oil, & think about throwing them in the mix :!: :?:

That's why I put this up on more than one board. Hopefully some patient, well experienced soapers will find it in their hearts to put up with this newbie's neediness

I will of course share whatever I learn with everybody, so that everyone can learn from my issues That's what these boards should be about, right? Everybody learning together & helping eachother!! 8)

So -- thank you Greg -- for your help.... and your enthusiasm!

I'll post some more tomorrow.... maybe a good night's sleep & not thinking about it for 8 hours will help!

 

[Guest]

I probably shouldn't have mentioned that. I might post a question there too if I wanted a broader audience, and I meant no criticism.

Go ahead and mess with the hemp. You can always buy more. Or you can just plug it into any old recipe if you want to just use it up.

I like the Hempster's Haven soap although I'm not convinced that it's any better than any other recipe I've either tried or concocted myself.

And just to repeat, I'm not any experienced expert. Actually I've been doing this only 6 weeks although my 2 years college chemistry and vast (too vast) number of years as an amateur chef have certainly helped me. It also helps that I'm not currently employed and I'm spending all my time on hobbies plus hopefully getting into better health (gotta start that exercising). There's a lot to be said for cooking skills when related to soaping, and also for college chemistry skills (whatever I remember which is little): a perfect storm. (Or maybe a perfect sprinkling.)

But I am enthusiastic.

 

[digit]

The main reason I bought it is because of the great things I've read about it, about it's ability to regenerate new cell growth, etc. I have some serious skin problems that I won't go into right now, so my main purpose for learning to make soap, is to make a product for myself that my body doesn't consider toxic!

Maybe the hemp would do me better in a lotion, or a leave-on product.

I think as a "leave on" product, the skin benifits would be greater. So, treat yourself to a yummy lotion or cream.

Digit

 

[SoapyGal]

The main reason I bought it is because of the great things I've read about it, about it's ability to regenerate new cell growth, etc. I have some serious skin problems that I won't go into right now, so my main purpose for learning to make soap, is to make a product for myself that my body doesn't consider toxic!

Maybe the hemp would do me better in a lotion, or a leave-on product.

I think as a "leave on" product, the skin benifits would be greater. So, treat yourself to a yummy lotion or cream.

Digit

HA! I'd love to, but I need a tutorial first!! I don't know how to make lotion or cream.

There's a thread in on -- I think -- the Bath & Body forum.... we're waiting for a tutorial to get posted....

Anybody know how to make lotion?

 

[SoapyGal]

Ok, for anyone who's interested in helping.... how does this sound?

* Lard - 50%
* Olive - 15%
* Hemp - 25%
* Castor - 10%

Hard = 25
Cleanse = 1
Cond = 72
Bubbly = 10
Creamy = 34
Iodine = 91
INS = 105

Lauric = 0
Linoleic = 20
Linolenic = 6
Myristic = 1
Oleic = 37
Palmitic = 17
Ricinoleic = 9
Stearic = 7

Any thoughts? Thanks

 

[Guest]

I think you should make it. I played with your dilemma too and I got similar numbers. Without CO/PKO/babassu your cleansing is going to be near zero and your bubbly will be low irrespective of how much castor you add.

Your 25 hardness is deceptive because lard should make good reasonably hard bars, so I'm going against SoapCalc to predict your recipe will be harder than the numbers. You can't always take SoapCalc's numbers at face value.

Conditioning is high as expected. Creamy is high from the castor and I like creamy lather over bubbly lather myself.

I don't know if this recipe will help your "alien" skin but if low cleansing, high conditioning, modest bubbly and very good creamy lather will help you then this recipe should please you.

Go ahead and make it. The oils are not that much money and you may learn something interesting. I suggest with your skin problems that you should not get too carried away with scents.

 

[SoapyGal]

Thanks, Greg.

I appreciate your taking time to help a fellow soaper. It's a shame more people didn't jump in here for discussion.... just for learning's sake for newbies who are still trying to learn and understand things.

Oh well.

I will give this a try tomorrow.

I won't be using any scent on it yet. For R & D, I prefer to make my first batch of a recipe without scent.... that way I'm not distracted by the scent, and I can focus 100% on what the oils bring to the soap. I have discovered what the natural scents of the oils are by doing it this way. As a matter of fact, I discovered that my 100% olive oil castile soap smells so yummy all by itself, without any added fragrance, that I prefer that natural scent for a castile bar to any artificial scent, so that's how I will make it from now on.

I made a 100% olive oil bar last weekend, with goat's milk as my liquid, and I did it CP this time, instead of HP in the crockpot. It'll be curing for quite a while, but I've already noticed that the goat milk added to it has given it a bit of a different smell. I'll be curious to see if there's any other differences in the soap, such as lather or conditioning.

I agree with you about the numbers on soap calc. They're ok for guidelines, I guess. But they really don't give an accurate measure of the finished soap. As an example, my castile bar. The cleansing number is "0". So, at first glance, a person would think that the soap isn't capable of cleansing, right? But that's not true. It cleans great, as well as any soap I've ever used. The hardness is 15, that tells me it's a soft bar, right? Wrong... when it's cured, it's hard as a brick.

So, as a newbie, I really don't know how to get the most out of the calculator as far as the numbers go. The only thing about it that really helps me at all is in figuring out how much water, lye, oils, etc to use.

I'll make the soap tomorrow & letcha know how it went.

Again, thanks Greg, for all your help, and for being thoughtful enough to take time out of your day to reach out & help a fellow soaper.

 

[Guest]

You're welcome! I try to help although I'm pretty new to soaping and am no expert, although you know that.

I haven't quite taken my own advice on the scenting but I know it's true that many of my problems have been caused by scents, seizing, ricing, lumping, acceleration, or just plain the scent didn't smell as good in soap as OOB. I know it's good advice though.

Reading your post, I went and tried to decide what smell my 100% EVOO soap has, and I can't tell anything other than maybe a faint, clean smell. Perhaps my sense of smell isn't what it used to be, or perhaps it depends on the particular oil used. I'm using Trader Joe's EVOO, in soap, in cooking.

Please let us all know when you decide if your goat Castile has any more lather than ordinary Castile made with water. I'm sure all the GM enthusiasts believe that, but there's nothing like personal observation to prove or disprove common beliefs.

I think it depends on how you define cleansing. I don't take it as a synonym for cleaning. I've evidently just made an assumption, but my assumption is that 'cleansing' means the soap's ability to remove your natural skin oils from your skin. Soaps with high cleansing remove lots of your skin oils, and with no oils your skin feels dry, maybe even so dry your skin cracks. Perhaps somebody can tell me if my assumption is correct.

I've made soaps with AKO (hardness 6), canola (6), sweet almond (7) and OO (15). Squeezing them I can feel the slightest give to the AKO and almond. The canola has almost no give and the OO none I can feel. (I don't want to try finger nail tests because I don't want to disfigure my bars.) Evidently by the time you get to 20 or so your bars will be pretty hard, or at least will be if SoapCalc's numbers are consistent for mixed oil recipes.

I play with SoapCalc a lot and print out the recipes so I can refer to them later. The more I look at it the more sense it makes, although I think you have to look at all the numbers together not just one or two. Another thing that has helped me a lot, I spreadsheeted all my oils, took the numbers from SoapCalc for not only the qualities but also the fatty acids. I've spent hours staring at that spreadsheet particularly the fatty acids, trying to correlate the fatty acids with the qualities. I use this information when playing with recipes and I think I have made progress in understand what's happening.

Hey, we're all here to help. If it wasn't for the help I wouldn't even bother with forums. Helping others and getting help myself. That's how you learn.

 

[SoapyGal]

Another thing that has helped me a lot, I spreadsheeted all my oils, took the numbers from SoapCalc for not only the qualities but also the fatty acids. I've spent hours staring at that spreadsheet particularly the fatty acids, trying to correlate the fatty acids with the qualities. I use this information when playing with recipes and I think I have made progress in understand what's happening.

I did the same thing. It's easier for me that way when first putting a recipe together. I think this *synergy* that is talked about, is probably a recipe that has a little bit of ALL the FA's, and not overly high in any particular one.... but what do I know? That's just my guess for right now.

 

[Guest]

I did the same thing. It's easier for me that way when first putting a recipe together.

You da smart chick! Only I'm not sure that "overly high in any particular one" is the idea. I think you need to understand the purposes and effects of the various FAs and add them depending on what effect you want to achieve. Perhaps "overly high" might be a desired effect, but maybe not.

Actually I have wondered if it's just as simple as the FA lineup of your whole recipe, whether two recipes with the same FA lineup are about the same. I don't think it's that simple but I've wondered.

This is a pretty difficult subject for us newbies.

 

[digit]

It's a shame more people didn't jump in here for discussion.... just for learning's sake for newbies who are still trying to learn and understand things.

You have to give folks some time. Some days are quieter than others. There are many helpful people here, but folks have other things going on.

Patience is key in learning a new skill. Yes, I stand at the corner waiting for the UPS guy to get his sweet bippy in gear to deliver my supplies. My "want to do" list is longer than I have life left in me.

As a newbie myself, I spend countless hours researching and reading. Of course, I want to know right away an answer so I can proceed at that moment, but I have learned so many things while seeking one answer that I would not have come across otherwise.

Patience, Grasshopper.

Digit