dixiedragon
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What facts? I don't see any facts regarding the fragrance oils purchased for soaping containing vegetable oil.
Mixing Fragrance Oils with lye water has anyone done this?
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zolveria
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Nope. I ASKED that question on Facebook a d she says no. Her mom did it. A d she encourages it.. I'm gonna wait till the lye is Room temperature
The Wikipedia article referenced by OldHippie contains that bit of information. Like I said, I looked at a bunch of MSDS for the FOs I use, and none contained veg oil as an ingredient. Not to say it's never used in FOs, just that I'm not seeing it in the MSDS that I have.
zolveria
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Listen 1gram of lye to twice water and add your fragrance oil to test. I'm dping this TONIGHT will get back
Just do not depend on one fragrance to do this test. Not all act the same. I only test them if I have new fragrance that I suspect might not behave. Some will separate, some will clump, some will behave and some change color
OldHippie
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You're ignoring the FACT that makers of fragrance oils hide behind Trade Secret regulations and do not tell you what ingredients are in them except for those that present a health or environmental hazard, or have an occupational Exposure Limit. Those are the only ingredients listed on the MSDS. That's why you won't see veg oil listed if it contains it. Any ingredients you see listed on a fragrance oil will not be an exhaustive list. We don't know what is in fragrance oil, and you can call all of the vendors that you want; they don't know what's in it either (although they may be willing to share their "beliefs").
As for my attitude...
I worked my way through school (summa cum laude, double major) as a research assistant, so I have a low tolerance level for bad science. I have an even lower tolerance level for statements of belief presented as knowledge. This is what triggered me to challenge the broad contention that fragrance oils won't saponify.
I have shown that the ingredients of fragrance oils are proprietary and not disclosed. If you don't know what's in them, you cannot know what is NOT in them, and you cannot draw conclusions about them. Maybe there are fragrance oils that don't saponify. My point is, that short of private testing, you don't know, and the vendors don't either.
As for my attitude...
I worked my way through school (summa cum laude, double major) as a research assistant, so I have a low tolerance level for bad science. I have an even lower tolerance level for statements of belief presented as knowledge. This is what triggered me to challenge the broad contention that fragrance oils won't saponify.
I have shown that the ingredients of fragrance oils are proprietary and not disclosed. If you don't know what's in them, you cannot know what is NOT in them, and you cannot draw conclusions about them. Maybe there are fragrance oils that don't saponify. My point is, that short of private testing, you don't know, and the vendors don't either.
Monitor any temperature changes.
I haven't seen any evidence that there is any such thing as an undiluted fragrance oil.
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I'm getting lost, so make it simpler for me. Is your essential point that the rest of us are incompetent because we use fragrance oils? Or is your point simply that you don't think people should use fragrance oils? Or what?
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zolveria
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I THINK She saying that adding fragrance oils to lye water needs to be tested individually and with a good control. Each fragrance that gives etc has to be Temp etc of lye water.. I'm def gonna play 2mprrow morning. Gonna behave and turn in early.2nite.
OldHippie
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Come on DeeAnna, you're projecting now. My only point is that we don't know what is in fragrance oils. What you do with that info is up to you. My personal opinions are beside the point.
But as a fragrance oil recipe is proprietary, could they be said to be diluted as such? It's the recipe, after all.
Oldhippie- please start a new thread if you want to take this any further. Things are straying way off topic from what the OP intended.
IrishLass
IrishLass
OldHippie
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Obviously, you can't say anything about them if you don't know what is in them. What does this have to do with my comment? I choose my words carefully. Read it again. If someone can show me an undiluted fragrance oil, I'd love to see it.
Take WHAT any further? I made my conclusion and I'm just responding to questions. I don't know what an "OP" is, but the person who started this thread "likes" my posts, and we are having a continuing discussion.Oldhippie- please start a new thread if you want to take this any further. Things are straying way off topic from what the OP intended.
IrishLass
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Example - I made a lotion last night which contains an amount of water. But as that is actually part of my lotion, it can't be said that it (the lotion) is diluted because that is my lotion. If someone added more water TO my product, it is now diluted.
If an FO contains an oil as part of the recipe, it isn't diluted. If more is added later, it is
OldHippie
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I don't think that's what IrishLass meant, but then, you'll have to ask her.
1. Your tone is argumentative rather than conversational. 2. You're expressing a point of view based on generic references you've provided rather than on specific data. 3. You haven't directly and specifically answered my questions.
I'm done with this.
If I read your tone correctly, it sounds like you think I'm trying to pick a fight with you, but that is far from the truth. The OP (original post/original poster) inquired about adding accelerating fragrance oils to lye in the hope of preventing them from accelerating. Since the discussion has now strayed far from the original topic in question, I was only suggesting a new thread be started to carry on the 'new' though/subject matter. That is all.
IrishLass
OldHippie
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I stated a fact. The ingredients of fragrance oils are proprietary and not disclosed. Others want to argue because they don't want to believe it - or the implications. Kill the messenger.
Oh, don't presume to know what I based my point of view on. I did plenty of research. It's what I do. I provided the examples to give you a starting point if you wanted to pursue it.
Looking back, you asked me.
1. "So what facts are you talking about?"
As I explained: "The ingredients of fragrance oils are proprietary and not disclosed."
2. "And why are you taking this tone?"
I confessed my attitude in a post.
I have a lot of respect for you, DeeAnna, and I often "like" your posts because you usually give good advice and have a sound basis for what you say. I didn't expect you to get so defensive that you made the following baseless assertion which I will not dignify with an answer.
3. "Is your essential point that the rest of us are incompetent because we use fragrance oils?"
4. "Or is your point simply that you don't think people should use fragrance oils? "
I think that people should make their own decisions based upon valid information. In this case, the valid information is that we don't have any information.
5. Or what?
At the risk if repeating myself,
"The ingredients of fragrance oils are proprietary and not disclosed." You cannot make an assumption about much of anything about the ingredients, much less state one as a fact. This was my only point.
I know I am.
zolveria
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okay so this is what i did.
water had 1tbs of salt and 1tbsp of sugar.
13 oz water
6 oz lye
1tbs Green Leaf & Bamboo Ultra (save on citric)
my slow moving recipe 42:58
TO= 1/4 tsp in lye water did not help.. left speckles.. i never really mastered TO i use Kaolin normally. ( speckle in Soap Pic) smh
lye water temp 98
added 1 tbsp of salt and sugar.
added 1 oz of water to fragrance oil. then added it to lye water.
then added it to my oils.
PAST EXPERIENCE: my oils will sieze and just become Pudding stiff.
Now with this method. I had small speckle and modereate thickening. will post pictures
water had 1tbs of salt and 1tbsp of sugar.
13 oz water
6 oz lye
1tbs Green Leaf & Bamboo Ultra (save on citric)
my slow moving recipe 42:58
TO= 1/4 tsp in lye water did not help.. left speckles.. i never really mastered TO i use Kaolin normally. ( speckle in Soap Pic) smh
lye water temp 98
added 1 tbsp of salt and sugar.
added 1 oz of water to fragrance oil. then added it to lye water.
then added it to my oils.
PAST EXPERIENCE: my oils will sieze and just become Pudding stiff.
Now with this method. I had small speckle and modereate thickening. will post pictures
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zolveria
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So in the end the confounded fragrance oil did it again leaking oil. On tried and true soap formula smh. This is only behaves in body wash and I still have to add crothix. In candles it's amazing and in reeds
penelopejane
Well-Known Member
I am sorry but your abbreviations and incomplete sentences make it difficult to understand your posts.
What is TO?
Smh?
That is a huge amount of salt and sugar to add to 14 oz (400g) of oil. I use 1 tsp salt per 500g sometimes less.
I don’t use sugar but I use honey sometimes and I use far less.
Maybe the excess sugar is causing the oil to leak out as it overheated?
The speckles could be undissolves salt (although they usually have a halo) or dissolved salt or sugar.
Was the water you added to the FO part of your recipe water or extra?
I can’t find that FO on their website so can’t read reviews but note that some of their FOs are only suitable for lotions (not soap).
What is TO?
Smh?
That is a huge amount of salt and sugar to add to 14 oz (400g) of oil. I use 1 tsp salt per 500g sometimes less.
I don’t use sugar but I use honey sometimes and I use far less.
Maybe the excess sugar is causing the oil to leak out as it overheated?
The speckles could be undissolves salt (although they usually have a halo) or dissolved salt or sugar.
Was the water you added to the FO part of your recipe water or extra?
I can’t find that FO on their website so can’t read reviews but note that some of their FOs are only suitable for lotions (not soap).
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