Beth Ann
New Member
What are the ingredients in her shampoo bars? Im looking for minimal ingredients but not just a fancy soap!
Make Your Own Naturally Balanced Shampoo Bars
- Thread starter nframe
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Ditto. I don't use any CAPB in mine as it is a known irritant. I also had problems with SLSA until I took it down to not more than 5% of my recipe ( it made my head very itchy). I use foaming apple at circa 10%.
nframe
Well-Known Member
[QUOTE="Misschief, post: 926414, member: 19626"
If your scalp is itchy using the pressed bars, it's likely because of the CAPB. You can sub it out for something like Foaming Silk, Foaming Apple, or Foaming Oat, different surfactants. That has made a big difference for several people, including my husband. I now have one bar that I call my Winter Scalp bar that uses Foaming Silk and additives like nettle and white willow bark extracts as well as EO's good for hair and scalp (tea tree and rosemary).
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Thank you for that. I never thought the irritation could be due to the CAPB. I looked on the web for Foaming apple, foaming silk etc. and cannot find them (I live in the UK). I have at home a surfactant called Plantapon. The website says : A 'green' liquid surfactant blend (Lauryl glucoside and Sodium lauryl glucose carboxylate) which can be used, typically at 10% in water as a 'principal surfactant' to make up a base for shower gel, body wash etc. Do you think that would be suitable?
If your scalp is itchy using the pressed bars, it's likely because of the CAPB. You can sub it out for something like Foaming Silk, Foaming Apple, or Foaming Oat, different surfactants. That has made a big difference for several people, including my husband. I now have one bar that I call my Winter Scalp bar that uses Foaming Silk and additives like nettle and white willow bark extracts as well as EO's good for hair and scalp (tea tree and rosemary).
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Thank you for that. I never thought the irritation could be due to the CAPB. I looked on the web for Foaming apple, foaming silk etc. and cannot find them (I live in the UK). I have at home a surfactant called Plantapon. The website says : A 'green' liquid surfactant blend (Lauryl glucoside and Sodium lauryl glucose carboxylate) which can be used, typically at 10% in water as a 'principal surfactant' to make up a base for shower gel, body wash etc. Do you think that would be suitable?
I'll confess that I'm no expert when it comes to surfactants. You may need to to do some digging on the Swift Crafty Monkey site. My feeling is that you cannot swap them.
nframe
Well-Known Member
Thank you anyway.
Thank you for that. I never thought the irritation could be due to the CAPB. I looked on the web for Foaming apple, foaming silk etc. and cannot find them (I live in the UK). I have at home a surfactant called Plantapon. The website says : A 'green' liquid surfactant blend (Lauryl glucoside and Sodium lauryl glucose carboxylate) which can be used, typically at 10% in water as a 'principal surfactant' to make up a base for shower gel, body wash etc. Do you think that would be suitable?
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I'd test it. I've seen bar recipes that include Alkyl polyglucosides (the most common one I've seen being Decyl glucoside which has a quick but relatively unstable foam). Lauryl glucoside has an excellent foam profile. The sodium lauryl glucose carboxylate is also an Alkyl polyglucoside and from what I've read (in the last two minutes) adds more mildness and conditioning but both components are fairly mild.
Edit: I see the hot pour recipe actually uses decyl glucoside so the Plantapon would be a good drop-in. You might be able to sub it for the betaine as well. The advantage to using the CAPB is that it is amphoteric, but if you were replacing with any of the foaming oat/foaming apple, that's just more anionic so you wouldn't have the amphoteric in there anyway. Having the amphoteric in there is sometimes important for the foam level/stability but isn't always necessary.
Sorry, last edit: it shouldn't be an issue because the plantapon's pH is 5-6 ish range but you still should always pH test your shampoo bars.
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If you go to Etsy and look up the recipes she has for sale, she lists all of the required ingredients for each recipe in the Description. You have to click to expand that section (it's on the right side for me), and scroll way down till you find it. It's a nice feature since you can see what is needed before buying the recipe.
nframe
Well-Known Member
I'd test it. I've seen bar recipes that include Alkyl polyglucosides (the most common one I've seen being Decyl glucoside which has a quick but relatively unstable foam). Lauryl glucoside has an excellent foam profile. The sodium lauryl glucose carboxylate is also an Alkyl polyglucoside and from what I've read (in the last two minutes) adds more mildness and conditioning but both components are fairly mild.
Edit: I see the hot pour recipe actually uses decyl glucoside so the Plantapon would be a good drop-in. You might be able to sub it for the betaine as well. The advantage to using the CAPB is that it is amphoteric, but if you were replacing with any of the foaming oat/foaming apple, that's just more anionic so you wouldn't have the amphoteric in there anyway. Having the amphoteric in there is sometimes important for the foam level/stability but isn't always necessary.
Sorry, last edit: it shouldn't be an issue because the plantapon's pH is 5-6 ish range but you still should always pH test your shampoo bars.
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Thank you. I'll try the Plantapon next time. Your knowledge of surfactants is amazing! I get confused with all these terms - amphoteric, anionic, etc. They don't mean a lot to me.
Edit: I see the hot pour recipe actually uses decyl glucoside so the Plantapon would be a good drop-in. You might be able to sub it for the betaine as well. The advantage to using the CAPB is that it is amphoteric, but if you were replacing with any of the foaming oat/foaming apple, that's just more anionic so you wouldn't have the amphoteric in there anyway. Having the amphoteric in there is sometimes important for the foam level/stability but isn't always necessary.
Sorry, last edit: it shouldn't be an issue because the plantapon's pH is 5-6 ish range but you still should always pH test your shampoo bars.
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Thank you. I'll try the Plantapon next time. Your knowledge of surfactants is amazing! I get confused with all these terms - amphoteric, anionic, etc. They don't mean a lot to me.
Here is a good resource explaining how differently charged surfactants are used in different formulations: An Easy Guide to Understanding How Surfactants Work | IPC
Basically, in formulations, you use differently charged surfactants (anionic, nonionic, amphoteric) to clean different soils or to provide different characteristics (most importantly in shampoo: foam and mildness). Most of the soils in your hair are oily soils, so we primarily use anionic surfactants (SCI, sulfates) because they work the best to clean these types of soil. Using cosurfactants helps to stabilize the formula (more important in water based products) and build foam, affects viscosity (important in water based products as well), and helps to make the shampoo milder.
Basically, in formulations, you use differently charged surfactants (anionic, nonionic, amphoteric) to clean different soils or to provide different characteristics (most importantly in shampoo: foam and mildness). Most of the soils in your hair are oily soils, so we primarily use anionic surfactants (SCI, sulfates) because they work the best to clean these types of soil. Using cosurfactants helps to stabilize the formula (more important in water based products) and build foam, affects viscosity (important in water based products as well), and helps to make the shampoo milder.
nframe
Well-Known Member
Thank you. That was really informative,
SirSoapsAlot
Member
From the research I had saved, Decyl glucoside does have a stable foam. I believe I got this info from Formula Botanica when I was looking up natural surfactants.
Thank you for that. I never thought the irritation could be due to the CAPB. I looked on the web for Foaming apple, foaming silk etc. and cannot find them (I live in the UK). I have at home a surfactant called Plantapon. The website says : A 'green' liquid surfactant blend (Lauryl glucoside and Sodium lauryl glucose carboxylate) which can be used, typically at 10% in water as a 'principal surfactant' to make up a base for shower gel, body wash etc. Do you think that would be suitable?
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What is CAPB please!
CAPB = Cocamidopropyl Betaine
Sorry, I misspoke, less stable (not unstable) when compared with like coco and lauryl glucoside...at least according to this supplier: https://www.ipcol.com/blog/an-easy-guide-to-understanding-surfactants/
I think the differences among the top three in the picture are minute enough to not really make that big of a difference in a shampoo bar...which is why I think they can substitute the plantapon for e.g. decyl glucoside without seeing many/any negative effects on the showy-ness of the bar.
I have since purchased the hot pour recipes. I'm having difficulties finding some of the ingredients. I just made a huge order from Soap and More. Do you have any suggestions for some of the rarer ingredients?
Which ingredients are you referring to?
Decyl Glucoside & Liquid bamboo, sunflower & seaweed extracts. I guess it is just mostly the extracts I could not find. lol
I found the decyl glocoside -
I get most of my extracts at New Directions but I know there are others who carry it as well. Voyageur has some, Candora has some, Windy Point has some. Being in Canada, I do try to get them from Canadian suppliers as much as possible. That said, I have also purchased from Formulator Sample Shop.
My sunflower extract is the powdered version.
I do try to keep my orders in Canada as well. I will do some more shopping lol.
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