How Much Cocoa Butter

[MissE]

Hi guys, I haven't yet figured my recipe but I'm considering it. So I want to know how much cocoa butter (in percentage) I can use in a recipe to retain the chocolate scent and not have any other problems (also, what are some problems to consider).

Thanks!

 

[DeeAnna]

The chocolate scent doesn't survive in soap. Some people say it lingers faintly for a while, but it doesn't last. If you want a lasting and definite chocolate scent in your soap, you should consider using a chocolate fragrance oil.

I think most people most of the time use cocoa butter at 5% to 20% of the total fats.

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

I don't use it myself, but from reading here some people tried 30% and found that the lather was reduced, so like DeeAnna I would suggest lower than that.

Maybe make some smaller batches with 5, 10, and 20% to get a feel for each and narrow your range for trying more. For example, if 10 isn't enough and 20 is too much for your particular recipe, you could try 15 and see. But you'd have some great markers to work from

 

[MissE]

The chocolate scent doesn't survive in soap. Some people say it lingers faintly for a while, but it doesn't last. If you want a lasting and definite chocolate scent in your soap, you should consider using a chocolate fragrance oil.

I think most people most of the time use cocoa butter at 5% to 20% of the total fats.

Thanks DeeAnna, I was rather more hopeful about the scent
I'll also see about the 20%, I wonder do I have to use more soft oils with it or any such consideration for a good bar of soap?

 

[dibbles]

I made an unscented soap with natural cocoa butter a couple of weeks ago. It smelled like brownies baking overnight while it was gelling and cooling down. It had a decent chocolate smell for a few days, but is fading and now there is just a faint chocolate smell. I suspect the smell will be gone by, or shortly after, the bars are fully cured. I used 10%.

 

[DeeAnna]

I can't answer that question -- I hope someone who uses cocoa butter more than I do will help you out.

 

[MissE]

I don't use it myself, but from reading here some people tried 30% and found that the lather was reduced, so like DeeAnna I would suggest lower than that.

Maybe make some smaller batches with 5, 10, and 20% to get a feel for each and narrow your range for trying more. For example, if 10 isn't enough and 20 is too much for your particular recipe, you could try 15 and see. But you'd have some great markers to work from

I'll definitely listen to your wisdom and I'll try variations. I'll do it in the range of 20 and maybe up to 30 just to see, before going right down if need be. Just because I want to see how much scent is possible to be retained without an FO and I'm thinking the more the coco butter the better the retention. I can do up the lather with sugar and/or SL

 

[Obsidian]

I've used it at 20% before and it was ok, think it would have been better at 15%. The scent lingered for a couple weeks but it was very faint.

 

[MissE]

I made an unscented soap with natural cocoa butter a couple of weeks ago. It smelled like brownies baking overnight while it was gelling and cooling down. It had a decent chocolate smell for a few days, but is fading and now there is just a faint chocolate smell. I suspect the smell will be gone by, or shortly after, the bars are fully cured. I used 10%.

Thanks, dibbles, I hope I can check with you in another couple of weeks?

 

[MissE]

I've used it at 20% before and it was ok, think it would have been better at 15%. The scent lingered for a couple weeks but it was very faint.

Thanks, Obsidian, that helps me out.

 

[HowieRoll]

In January 2017 I made an unscented batch using this cocoa butter from New Directons (the pure prime pressed -crude one). It's unrefined, and smells very, very cocoa-y. The recipe I came up with was:

45% Olive Oil
20% Cocoa Butter
20% Coconut Oil
10% Avocado Oil
5% Castor Oil

5% ppo sugar
40% lye concentration
5% superfat

I really like the soap. It lathers well (at least with our water) and retained the cocoa scent for quite some time (months and months, it seemed, although, as expected, it did fade somewhat. But in the shower it comes back some). I also tried an experiment where I put a couple cured bars into a container with unused, dry coffee grounds for a month or so and, to my nose, it brought out the cocoa smell even more. A friend of mine especially loves this soap. Now that I think of it, I need to make more!

 

[Arimara]

I might have to try Howie's recipe some time. I also use 20% cocoa butter in s recipe I modified from Anne Watson. It's still one of my personal favorites.

 

[SaltedFig]

I did a quick check of some my recipes with cocoa, and I tend to use it mostly around 5% to 10%. The cocoa butter scent is nice but does fade. The only time I can still smell chocolate after 6 months is if I've added other ingredients to boost the chocolate, like cocoa powder.

 

[dibbles]

Thanks, dibbles, I hope I can check with you in another couple of weeks?

Sure!

 

[Zany_in_CO]

David Fisher (The Spruce) has a tried and true Double Butter recipe (13% cocoa & 12% shea) where he explains the need to bump the coconut oil (35%) and add castor (5%) to offset the stingy lather of butters in soap recipes.

He does an in-the-pot swirl which is optional, but you might want to try it with an ounce of chocolate chips (?) (deduct an ounce from CB or shea) tossed in. Just one quick swirl with a spoon for a better effect, then pour. Be sure to run the recipe through a calculator before making it. Here's a link:

https://www.thespruce.com/double-butter-soap-recipe-516610

HTH :bunny:​

 

[MissE]

In January 2017 I made an unscented batch using this cocoa butter from New Directons (the pure prime pressed -crude one). It's unrefined, and smells very, very cocoa-y. The recipe I came up with was:

45% Olive Oil
20% Cocoa Butter
20% Coconut Oil
10% Avocado Oil
5% Castor Oil

5% ppo sugar
40% lye concentration
5% superfat

I really like the soap. It lathers well (at least with our water) and retained the cocoa scent for quite some time (months and months, it seemed, although, as expected, it did fade somewhat. But in the shower it comes back some). I also tried an experiment where I put a couple cured bars into a container with unused, dry coffee grounds for a month or so and, to my nose, it brought out the cocoa smell even more. A friend of mine especially loves this soap. Now that I think of it, I need to make more!

I do believe I'm going to abandon my search for a recipe and try yours! Thanks so much!

Just to clarify, is 40% lye concentration your usual or is it particular to this recipe? I usually do 33%.

I did a quick check of some my recipes with cocoa, and I tend to use it mostly around 5% to 10%. The cocoa butter scent is nice but does fade. The only time I can still smell chocolate after 6 months is if I've added other ingredients to boost the chocolate, like cocoa powder.

Yes, cocoa powder! Thanks!

David Fisher (The Spruce) has a tried and true Double Butter recipe (13% cocoa & 12% shea) where he explains the need to bump the coconut oil (35%) and add castor (5%) to offset the stingy lather of butters in soap recipes.

He does an in-the-pot swirl which is optional, but you might want to try it with an ounce of chocolate chips (?) (deduct an ounce from CB or shea) tossed in. Just one quick swirl with a spoon for a better effect, then pour. Be sure to run the recipe through a calculator before making it. Here's a link:

https://www.thespruce.com/double-butter-soap-recipe-516610

HTH :bunny:​

Thanks for the tips and link.

 

[HowieRoll]

I do believe I'm going to abandon my search for a recipe and try yours! Thanks so much!

Just to clarify, is 40% lye concentration your usual or is it particular to this recipe? I usually do 33%.

I generally use a 38-40% lye concentration, as it seems to work well with my recipes and give me fluid batter for doing designs. My notes from this batch read: "batter stayed very fluid. Almost too much. Poured brown {note: I had added brown iron oxide to part of it} into mold and it looked too runny, so I dumped it back into bowl and SB to thin trace... Next time use thicker batter (for the design I was attempting)."

You may want to play around with the recipe, and maybe try upping the coconut oil by 5% and decreasing the olive oil by 5% (along the vein of what Zany suggests), although some people's skin does not like a lot of coconut oil. It doesn't bother me, so I may try doing that next time just to see if there is a marked difference.

Happy soaping!

 

[MissE]

Thanks, HowieRoll!

 

[Brik]

I'm pretty new with soap making, too, so I'm curious. Would the scent last longer if you reserved some as your superfat and hot processed, adding it in after the cook?

 

[Millie]

I have a 50% cocoa butter soap a year and a half old. The scent was never very strong - maybe about the strength of a fully cured citrus EO soap. Except it smelled just like chocolate cake! The scent of the dry soap is almost gone at this point, but I tried it last night and the scent came back in the shower. I was very pleased with the strength of the lather, although it has an unusual character. In the first few months it was very dry and fluffy, and made me think of egg whites whipped into stiff peaks. Six or so months in it was like whipped cream. Currently it has the most dense, lotion-like lather I've ever experienced. The lather through all stages has been amazingly abundant. Happy to pass along my recipe if you are still looking to experiment, although if I ever make a high cocoa butter soap again I have a few changes in mind.

ETA: It kind of reminded me of a shaving soap last night. I passed my hands over the bar, filled my hands with lotiony lather (um, somewhere between lotion and toothpaste), set the bar down, rubbed my hands, et voila: perfect looking shaving cream lather. Songwind would be jealous

Ok, one last thought: Chocolate Orange Patchouli scent. Next time.