Help with Fast Trace

[MatsuoMiku]

Hello, I need help with my soap. I made papaya cold process soap here's my recipe:
11oz olive oil
4.4oz coconut oil
6.6oz palm oil
3.047oz Lye
7.26oz Liquid (i use 50% water i dissolve lye here, and then other 50% was the natural papaya juice)
with 5% superfat

these was my recipe and this is my second batch that made 2lbs of soap.
I used room temp oils and lye. First I mixed the papaya juice on oils and the i mix them for about 5-10 mins. Then, I mixed the lye water solution to my oils then i mix it for about 15 mins and it already reached trace, btw i don't use stick blender just manual. It came out creamy. I also put some little water before the trace cause i got scared that my soap will be lye heavy.I also felt that my mixture is getting hot while mixing. I don't know what I did wrong, please someone help me. Thank You very much for the help!

 

[IrishLass]

Welcome, MatsuoMiku!

It sounds to me like everything went well, actually. I looked at your recipe on SoapCalc, and if you weighed everything correctly, it shouldn't be lye heavy at all. By the way, adding water won't help lessen lye heaviness in a lye-heavy soap, but adding more oil will.

The heat you experienced as you were mixing is nothing unusual. That's all a part of the saponification reaction between the oils lye and the sugars in your papaya juice. Nothing to be worried about- it's perfectly natural and to be expected., so you can rest at ease.

As for the seemingly fast trace- 15 minutes doesn't seem too fast, at least not to me. But then again, I use a 33% lye solution most times and they usually come to a medium-thick (pudding-like) trace in about 10 minutes or so (quicker if my fragrance oil is an ornery one).

Lets us know how things progress!

IrishLass

 

[MatsuoMiku]

Welcome, MatsuoMiku!

It sounds to me like everything went well, actually. I looked at your recipe on SoapCalc, and if you weighed everything correctly, it shouldn't be lye heavy at all. By the way, adding water won't help lessen lye heaviness in a lye-heavy soap, but adding more oil will.

The heat you experienced as you were mixing is nothing unusual. That's all a part of the saponification reaction between the oils lye and the sugars in your papaya juice. Nothing to be worried about- it's perfectly natural and to be expected., so you can rest at ease.

As for the seemingly fast trace- 15 minutes doesn't seem too fast, at least not to me. But then again, I use a 33% lye solution most times and they usually come to a medium-thick (pudding-like) trace in about 10 minutes or so (quicker if my fragrance oil is an ornery one).

Lets us know how things progress!

IrishLass

Wow thanks for the help i thought i've done something wrong because some says that manual mixing will take an hour up.Thank You!

 

[IrishLass]

Glad to be of help!

IrishLass

 

[MatsuoMiku]

Hello again, so i unmolded my soap a while ago and already cut it. I saw some white circle inside and also while i took it out of my mold its very oily at the bottom and there's also some kinda like water drops over my soap, btw before this I covered it with plastic, cardboard and towel to insulate it. I really think there's something wrong with my soap the white circles is it lye pockets? I already zap test it zing well it's normal for first day i know and is it because of the fast trace that came out to be a false trace? Well, thank u for the help!

 

[MatsuoMiku]

here's the photo of my soap.

 

[IrishLass]

By 'white circles', do you mean white dots? If so, it's very possible they are 'stearic spots', which are harmless (albeit unsightly). One way to tell is to dig one out and rub it in between your fingers. If it feels buttery/lotion/waxy, it is most likely stearic acid from the palm oil that precipitated out of the mixture because the overall temp dropped to far below the melting point of the palm before the lye could react with it properly.

In re-reading over your original post, I think it is very likely that your fast trace, combined with the resulting white spots (if they are indeed stearic spots) indicates that you had a false trace due to the palm not being able to stay in melted suspension.

As for the oil and the water drops- it sounds to me like your soap may have over-heated- which is fairly common when adding sugar or sugary liquids to a batch.

To avoid false trace (and stearic spots) with recipes containing palm or other high-stearic fats, I like to soap at around 110F/43C (at least).

Many times, when one ends up with minor oily and/or sweating soap, I've found that if you leave it alone for a few days, the oil and water will absorb back in. Is the soap sitting in puddles of oil, or does the bottom just feel oily to the touch?

IrishLass


Edited to add:

I just saw your pictures after hitting 'send'. We must have been posting at the same time. lol

To my eyes, based on my own dealings with stearic spots in the past, those white areas look like harmless stearic spots. Otherwise, your soap looks perfectly fine.

Edited again to add: Does it zap when applying the tongue test?

 

[MatsuoMiku]

Yes it does zap. If it is false trace is it still safe to use? Some bars doesn't have it and I will try to test the texture of that white to make sure.

 

[MatsuoMiku]

here's closer look.

 

[MatsuoMiku]

I test the texture of the white spots it's slimy,buttery and also yes my unmolded soap sits in oil but when i cut it it faded already.

 

[IrishLass]

Thanks for the closer pics. Yes- those do look very much like stearic spots to me.

Even though you had fast trace, the soap will be perfectly safe to use just as long as it doesn't zap. I would tongue test it again in about a week or so to see if the zap is gone yet. Don't be discouraged just because the soap is zapping at present, because it's still a very young soap yet and that is common with young soaps. If it's still zapping 8 to 14 days down the road, though, it will need to be re-batched with some extra oil added to it to neutralize any excess lye.

IrishLass

 

[MatsuoMiku]

Thank you for answering my questions you're super nice. I really wanted to make soaps since Christmas is coming you know presents for my family and friends and I wanna make sure my soaps are safe to use.
If you don't mind I wanna ask some more questions:
1.) Is it still possible to develop lye crystal even though the lye water is strained. I strained my lye water in this recipe.
2.)If i put puree from fruit is it okay? Where will i pour it in oils before pouring lye or in lye water?

 

[IrishLass]

Hi MatsuoMiku!

Re: question #1: I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility, but if you formulated properly by building a good cushion of superfat into your recipe, and then calculated properly and weighed properly (as well as strained your lye), then I would be somewhat doubtful about it. Do you suspect that you have lye crystals?

Re: question #2: Yes it's okay to put fruit puree in your soap. Just make sure to puree it really well so that there are no chunks, and don't use much more than 1 tablespoon per pound of oils in your soap. When I use purees in my soap, I like to stick-blend them into my oils before adding my lye solution.

IrishLass

 

[MatsuoMiku]

No i think I'm just curious since I'm new I don't know what lye crystal looks like and other failed results but i did what you have said I weigh it properly and strained it. I also having bad feeling since my soap had false trace, I thought that I haven't mixed the lye solution to oils properly and leaves some unmixed lye.