Help !!! Dual lye

[Tmwmo5]

Help!!! I’m trying to formulate a hybrid shave soap 65% Koh 35%noah I’m doing cold process As this is what I’m used to, it didn’t volcano it didn’t turn to apple sauce or mashed potato it stayed quite fluid the pour was good but now after 24 hrs in mould this is what it looks like recipe is also below is this normal it has like a gel texture will this harden ? If not can I rebatch ? How do I rebatch ? I started making cp soap 10 years ago I’ve never used dual lye before this is my first time

 

[AliOop]

In order to help you, we really need to know your whole recipe, and the entire process that you used. Without knowing that, the best I can say is that it looks like you did not blend to trace, or you did not use enough lye solution.

 

[DeeAnna]

The implication I'm getting from your post is you wanted to make bar (solid) soap, so I'm not quite sure why you used so much KOH. Stick to no more than 5% KOH ... 10% max ... if your goal is to make bar soap.

Unless you're trying to make shave soap, cream soap, or liquid soap, you really don't want to use nearly that much KOH. You've basically made liquid soap paste, not bar soap.

It looks fine for liquid soap paste. 35% NaOH, a 5% superfat, as well as the use of palm and shea will probably make the diluted soap somewhat (or a lot) cloudy when diluted. Hard to say -- you'll just have to dilute and see what you get.

@AliOop -- the recipe is sideways in the first photo. It's rather hard to find and difficult to read! But it's there

 

[AliOop]

Thanks, @DeeAnna and sorry @Tmwmo5; when I made my first comment, I was on my phone, and that first picture wouldn't load. Now that I switched to my computer, I can see it.

The OP did say this will be a dual-lye shave soap. It still looks pretty gel-like to me, and not firm enough for a shave soap. Which is probably a good thing, since it really should have been poured into a mold, or individual containers, when it was done being mixed (for CP) or cooked (for HP). If it had firmed up a lot, it would be very difficult to get out of the pot. @Tmwmo5 is this scoopable into containers?

 

[Tmwmo5]

It’s in a Pringles can for one as i put dimensions of Pringles can in calculator and got enough for a full Pringles can And 10x 105g aluminium tins with lids just took off the lids It’s a lot of soap it has firmed up you can’t put your finger in it it looks very gel like a little soft but a lot harder than last night. I’ve turned the recipe so it’s a little easier to read

In order to help you, we really need to know your whole recipe, and the entire process that you used. Without knowing that, the best I can say is that it looks like you did not blend to trace, or you did not use enough lye solution.

It was medium to heavy trace and looked like a normal heavy soap base when I put it in . It was also almost white

 

[AliOop]

Ok then! Is there a reason you didn't pour it right into the mold, or individual shave soap containers?

 

[Tmwmo5]

Ok then! Is there a reason you didn't pour it right into the mold, or individual shave soap containers?

I did as soon as I mixed to trace I poured into moulds and tins the pic is one of the tins I poured this is a 83mm tin

 

[AliOop]

I did as soon as I mixed to trace I poured into moulds and tins the pic is one of the tins I poured this is a 83mm tin

OH hahahah, I thought that was a big pot of your soap. Joke is on me!!

Have you tried using it with a shave brush yet? Some soapers really like a creamy paste consistency since it lathers up so quickly.

EDIT: wait, is that an aluminum tin? If so, and if you poured your soap in it while you still had active lye (not fully cooked to neutral) that is going to react with the aluminum. You'd have to toss the whole batch in that case.

 

[Tmwmo5]

In all fairness the one in the Pringles tin is exactly the same

 

[Zany_in_CO]

It looks fine for liquid soap paste. 35% NaOH, a 5% superfat, as well as the use of palm and shea will probably make the diluted soap somewhat (or a lot) cloudy when diluted.

I would try it undiluted... "as is" ...after at least 2-weeks cure. You may have invented Shave Soap Gel.

Have you tried using it with a shave brush yet? Some soapers really like a creamy paste consistency since it lathers up so quickly.

I like this idea. Once again, it needs to cure first. NaOH added to KOH soaps tend to get harder over time. I would probably pack it into a squeeze tube of some sort. Squirt some in your palm and lather up without a brush. See how it goes.

ETA: Here's a pic of some Beldi soap I made that's a KOH soap where the paste is not diluted but used as is for washing up. Lathers like a made dog. LOL

 

[DeeAnna]

...The OP did say this will be a dual-lye shave soap. ...

Thanks for pointing that out -- but then the OP goes on to ask if it will firm up. It really sounded like the OP wants this to be a solid soap. That was confusing to me. <sigh> It's been a long day....

Just speaking in general ... The recipe really does look more more like a typical liquid or bar soap recipe with some clay added. The recipe doesn't have nearly enough stearic and palmitic fatty acids to make a lubricating, stable lather.

 

[AliOop]

In all fairness the one in the Pringles tin is exactly the same

Sorry, I don’t know what you mean by this. The Pringles “tin” is actually cardboard, with a metal bottom that most soapmakers remove so the soap doesn’t come in contact with aluminum. That is a serious safety issue and your soap can’t be considered safe to use if you didn’t cook it completely (so it had zero active lye remaining) before adding it to the tins.

This is a great example of why we ask for your complete process. It’s hard for us to give good advice when we don’t know what you did.

 

[ElizHal267]

Ellen Ruth has a great video and gives the recipe. I used it for a wedding for the groomsmen with a shaving brush. My client said it was a big hit. Now I keep them in stock.

 

[Tmwmo5]

Ellen Ruth has a great video and gives the recipe. I used it for a wedding for the groomsmen with a shaving brush. My client said it was a big hit. Now I keep them in stock.

I’m gonna try it I think this is how they are 3 days later they have hardened up nicely but they dont look very nice so I’m gonna. See what they do in a lather test there ph yesterday after in moulding was at 9/10

 

[Tmwmo5]

So i guess that the hybrid soap I made just doesn’t look the part it lathers beautifully and stays for a while and even when the lather goes away it leaves a nice slippery moisturised skin behind for the razor so no need to re lather …. Next time I’m changing the fragrance to see if that was the cause of the …well… not so good look of this shaving soap I’m also going to add TD think I might make a small batch to play with fragrance and colour … but altogether it’s turned out ok in the pic the lather had been sat there for a couple of minutes before I took the photo… now to sort out packaging shall I box or wrap ?

 

[Zany_in_CO]

this is how they are 3 days later they have hardened up nicely but they dont look very nice

I actually quite like them! They look a little rough around the surface and edges, though. I would wait a week or two until they're cured enough to handle, then wash them in a warm salt water bath to smooth them.

So i guess that the hybrid soap I made just doesn’t look the part it lathers beautifully and stays for a while and even when the lather goes away it leaves a nice slippery moisturised skin behind for the razor so no need to re lather …. Next time

Gorgeous lather. And it holds!

You may not need to change a thing. There's no sense in rushing it. I would wait and see how they perform after at least a 4-week cure, maybe longer? It's too early to pass judgement. PATIENCE is the first rule of soapmaking. Give the soap some time to do its thing. Make up a Cure Card to weigh them on a regular schedule. When they stop losing weight that's the time to think about packaging.

HTH

 

[Tmwmo5]

I actually quite like them! They look a little rough around the surface and edges, though. I would wait a week or two until they're cured enough to handle, then wash them in a warm salt water bath to smooth them.

Gorgeous lather. And it holds! View attachment 71820

You may not need to change a thing. There's no sense in rushing it. I would wait and see how they perform after at least a 4-week cure, maybe longer? It's too early to pass judgement. PATIENCE is the first rule of soapmaking. Give the soap some time to do its thing. Make up a Cure Card to weigh them on a regular schedule. When they stop losing weight that's the time to think about packaging.

HTH

I actually like them now they have been curing for a bit and the colour is changing they are like an olive green it’s just the smell I don’t like (I hope I get the order right ) 1st pic it’s bars on the left … latest photo
2nd pic or middle one I hope …. About 3 days ago
3rdp pic 24 hours after pour
so asfar as the testing it does what it says on the tin it’s solid enough to be sold wrapped as a refil and in the tins as Is … I like the rustic look and feel to them I think it adds to the homemadeness if there is such a thing

 

[Zany_in_CO]

1st pic it’s bars on the left … latest photo

They are looking better! Remember, "The longer the cure, the better the soap!"