Goats milk

[ffynnon]

Hi all I have a question for those soapers that use goats milk. If you use fresh milk, is it pasteurized/homogenized from the supermarket or do you get raw milk from a local farm or indeed your own goats? Does pasturisation alter the benefits of goat milk?,
I know we are not supposed to make claims about soap being good for certain skin conditions but I don't make soap to sell yet. My son suffers from excema and my daughter in law has psoriasis. I'd like to make some goats milk soap to see if it would help either of them. Excema is not something my son had growing up so I think what he has now may be caused by fragranced soap/shower gels etc. it only seems to appear on his shins. My daughter in law has suffered psoriasis since she was a child, her grandmother also suffered.
I have done some research into the best oils to use and olive, coconut, sweet almond , jojoba and cocoa or shea butter seem to be the most common choices. Does unfragranced goat milk soap smell 'milky'? would adding essental oil be of any benefit (not lavender - they both hate lavender) tea tree or peppermint maybe?
Sorry for all the questions.

Thanks

 

[IrishLass]

Hi Ffynnon- I use fresh goat milk from the refrigerated section of my local grocery store (Meyernburg-brand) for my goat milk soap. It is pasteurized/homogenized.

As far as my soap deriving any benefits from the goat milk, the only benefits I have ever noticed is the nice, creamy 'body' it adds to my lather. Lye chemically reacts with and changes the properties of many of the things we add to our soaps- especially the oils/fats, of course- that I wouldn't rely on the natural health-giving properties of any of the things we might add as surviving the saponification process 100% intact/unscathed. Even if some do survive, being that soap is a wash-off product- quickly applied/quickly rinsed away- I can't imagine that much of any lasting health benefit would be derived from adding them. Although I use various additives when I make my soaps such as goat milk, honey, etc..., I include them for what they bring to the lather or to the looks of my soap instead of any possible health benefits. In order to derive lasting health benefits from certain additives such as essential oils, it is better to formulate a leave-on product like a lotion or a body butter instead.

You are on the right track for researching oils that are known for making gently cleansing soap. I would concentrate on formulating a gentle (unscented) bar and leaving the essential oils out for now (some can be irritating to the skin, especially peppermint). Bear in mind that not everyone can tolerate soap made of certain oils, even if the oils are on the 'gentle' list (a few of the members of our forum find olive oil to be irritating, for example). You'll have to do some trial and error experimentation in order to tailor things to your family's particular needs as they give you feedback.

One of the soap's that I make that I find to be very gentle is a tweak of Genny's shampoo bar recipe that she posted awhile ago. Granted, she formulated it to be used as a shampoo bar, but many on the forum have found it actually makes a wonderful, gently cleansing body soap. In place of soy oil %, I use high oleic safflower oil instead.

Does unfragranced goat milk soap smell 'milky'?

My unfragranced goat milk soap does not smell milky. I have to add a little bit of a milky scented FO to it in order for it to smell milky.

Hopefully more will chime in soon!


IrishLass

 

[ffynnon]

Thank you IrishLass. The EO was just a thought should the soap smell milky. I have frozen most of the carton of goats milk now. I will give it a go at the weekend and see how it turns out. I have had a look at the link you kindly put in your post and I think I have everything except the soya oil. I will run that recipe through a soap calc to see what the composition is like then play with the oils that I have in place of the soya oil, wonder if babassu oil would work.

 

[SoaperForLife]

I have customers with skin issues that swear by my patchouli essential oil soap. I have had others that did well with a solid lotion with no essential oils.

 

[Primrose]

I use raw goat milk but that is mostly because I love goats so I have a breeding flock

I don't think it makes any difference to the soap but then again I do sell a bit of milk to other soapers and they reckon it's heaps better than the shop bought stuff ...

 

[IrishLass]

Thank you IrishLass. The EO was just a thought should the soap smell milky. I have frozen most of the carton of goats milk now. I will give it a go at the weekend and see how it turns out. I have had a look at the link you kindly put in your post and I think I have everything except the soya oil. I will run that recipe through a soap calc to see what the composition is like then play with the oils that I have in place of the soya oil, wonder if babassu oil would work.

You're welcome. Babassu is completely different than soya oil in it's properties. In soap formulas, it's on the list of the uber bubbly, cleansing oils along with coconut oil and PKO. Adding too much of any of them will lead to an overly cleansing/drying soap. How much is too much will vary from person to person based on their individual skin-type. For what it's worth, some here on the forum can't use any more than 10% in their formula.....while others like me can use 30% and even 100%, provided I use a higher superfat.

When I sub out the soya in Genny's recipe I used a comparable oil, i.e., one without any lauric or myristic acids (the cleansing drying fatty acids in soap), but high in oleic and linoleic (the gentle, conditioning fatty acids). Babasu is high in the lauric and myristic acids and extremely low in the oleic and linoleic acids.

Even though Genny's formula has none of the uber bubbly/cleansing oils, it's still makes a wonderfully bubbly soap.


IrishLass

 

[Zany_in_CO]

I don't think GM soap is the answer for psoriasis or eczema.
For one thing, I made GM soap and lotion for a wholesale customer, who sold only GM soap/lotion for years. It didn't help her eczema. Neither did pine tar soap, BTW, although it's often thought of as a cure for eczema.

In a recent discussion on SMF about psoriasis, it was suggested that an activated charcoal bar might help. I gave one of mine to a woman I recently met, and she said it is helping.

There's more to the story.. there is hope for those that suffer from psoriasis and eczema. I really need to start a new thread. Later. Gotta run...

 

[Primrose]

Not going down the whole curing/claims thing but ...

My partner used to have psoriasis over 90% of his body. All he could use was either a very gentle syndet, or a goat milk handmade soap.

But the thing is, it wasn't the goat milk it was that he needed a soap that didn't dry out his skin.

I could make a goat milk soap with eg 40% coconut oil and I reckon it would dry people's skin out even though it's "goat milk soap" because the oil formulation was bad. Similarly I'm sure I could make a very gentle, low cleansing recipe without the goat milk and it would be just as good.

Goat milk does have label appeal and a reputation for being very gentle and good for sensitive skin or skin problems and hey I make exclusively goat milk soap and you can bet I don't tell my customers that I think it's just label appeal hahaha but really at the end of the day all you need for these skin conditions is a soap that doesn't strip your skin

 

[ffynnon]

Thanks everyone for your replies. Even though I live very rural here in Wales, I don't know anyone with goats. I will have to ask around. I just wanted to try goats milk for its gentle effect (although there are heaps of recipes that are gentle without the GM) I think I'm after something moisturizing (to calm itching of the excema), I'm not planning to fragrance the first batch I make. I have activated charcoal so may add some into half the batch as a swirl. My DIL has suffered psoriasis since she was a small child so she will be an excellent judge of how the soap behaves on the skin. One recipe I want to try is
Coconut oil 25%
Babassu oil 5%
Castor oil 5%
olive oil 35%
Shea butter 15%
Mango butter15%

35% water as % of oil (goats milk)
5% SF

opinions welcome. O0ps it's 3.20am, I better go get some sleep .

 

[Primrose]

Just based on what my and my partners skin likes/dislikes, the above recipe would be too drying for us. Coconut and babbassu are similar oils that are highly cleansing, bubbly and can be drying. Personally I keep these at or under 20% based on the good advice from others on this forum. The above recipe has a cleansing number of 20 and while I don't pay a great amount of attention to "the numbers" I do find that we prefer soap with a cleansing number less than 14.

I would personally remove the babbassu altogether, reduce the coconut to 20% and make the diference up with the olive oil, and see how you like that.

If you aren't opposed to animal fats, lard is a very skin loving oil to use up to 50% (some even do 100%)

 

[ffynnon]

thanks for that Primrose. No, I'm not opposed to animal fats at all so may give that another go soon.

 

[Zany_in_CO]

@Primrose Good advice.

@flynnon I don't know if this helps or not but I prefer using goat milk powder when making GM soap. I add it to my oils before adding the lye solution. To keep the batch from overheating, I chill my lye solution in the fridge over night and soap the next morning. Meyenburg is a popular brand here.

 

[ffynnon]

Thank you Zany-in-CO, I will add some to my next soaping order to try out

 

[Zany_in_CO]

I ran across this tutorial today while cleaning out my bookmarks. She talks about using GM powder to make GM soap.

Creamy Hot Process Goat Milk Soap