Difinitive WHEN on adding honey

[doggonegardener]

I HP and wanted to find out when is the best time to add honey. I searched and can't seem to find a definitive answer.

Today I made a batch that was 28% OO, 45% lard, 20% CO, 5% castor, 2% beeswax. I have had good luck lately with 2% sodium lactate and 50% water for a more pourable soap after the cook. I continued with this plan today.

I added 4% ppo honey after I reached trace (before the cook). The color morphed from a lovely beeswax yellow to this peachy/orange almost immediately. I didn't panic. However, what did concern me was that the batter broke just a couple of minutes after I put the lid on for the cook. I had to take the stick blender to it to get it to come back together.

There were NO stages. No champagne, no mashed potatoes, no vaseline.

This stuff was SOAP in just a few minutes. I zap tested multiple samples and got NO ZAP. It was maybe only a 10-15 minute cook and I had to SB the whole time.

The soap is now a really natural color. I lost all the wonderful smells of the hive as well.

I wonder, if you HP, when do you add your honey? Would it be reasonable to hold back the honey and the beeswax (melting point 140) until after the cook. I could melt them together in the microwave during the cook and stir them in right before I mold. Does that sound like it would be a fatal error? I was hoping for a soap with the faint scent of honey, pollen and beeswax. I am a beekeeper and I love the smell of the hive.

Thanks for any ideas you can offer. I have trouble with the search function and don't seem to have it figured out in a way that yields answers often. Also, what I kept finding was OMH issues and I didn't want to confuse my question with any milk issues since I wasn't using milk, just distilled water.

TIA

Rene

 

[navigator9]

I add honey to the hot lye water. I read this hint years ago, and it has always worked well for me. The heat makes sure that the honey melts completely, and then gets evenly distributed into the mix. The lye water turns an alarming shade of orange, but once mixed with the oil, my OMH soap turns a light brown. HTH

 

[doggonegardener]

orange not a surprise

navigator,

The orange morph at trace didn't surprise me. I had read that the honey/lye mix would likely turn orange. The ricing (i am assuming that is what I was seeing) was a surprise. The batter totally broke like a bad sauce.

What I am really trying to get is scent retention. I want the smell of honey and wax without having to add FO. Is that just going to be a pipedream?

I also wouldn't mind a lighter bar. I added pollen (cute little beads of pollen collected from the pollen baskets of honey bees) to the batter when I molded and if the batter were lighter, they would show up better.

Thanks for the reply. I look forward to any others. I am still excited to cut this in the am. I just wish it smelled like I envisioned in my head.

Rene

 

[judymoody]

I do the same as Navigator9. Then I wait for the lye mixture to cool down and that way the soap doesn't overheat.

 

[new12soap]

Sorry, but I have never found the scent of honey or beeswax to survive in soap. It doesn't matter when you add it.

I don't use anywhere near that much honey, I use a maximum of 1 tbsp ppo, and I mix it with a little water and add it after the cook, before I add the fragrance and mold it. I find adding it earlier just caramelizes the sugars, which I don't want. I don't use beeswax at all, I found it doesn't do anything for the soap, it just makes it feel waxy and adds drag and diminishes lather. I would save the beeswax for balms.

50% is a LOT of water, how long have you been using such high amounts? I have seen the current trend, but what no one has mentioned is how much shrinkage and warping of the bars is happening during cure. A nice smooth pour I can believe, but what about 2 months later? Just curious to know

 

[Chefmom]

I add 2 ounces of honey to my 100 ounce batches of hot process soaps. I add the honey when I add the fragrance or essential oils after the cook and before molding.

I have made soaps with a small amount of beeswax, but I have never seen a real reason to use it, and so I stopped.

Neither beeswax or honey scents remain after the soap is made, only fragrances give me the scent of honey. I love it as well, and use a honey fragrance in several blends.

 

[doggonegardener]

Thanks

I make a batch that's 800 grams of oils. I used 32 grams of honey.

I have been using the 50% water for a few batches now. Jury is still out on warping. I think I am getting some warp so I am going cut back a little each batch and see where I land.

I will try adding the honey after the cook next time to see if that helps keep the bar lighter in color.

Wish the natural scent of hive would stick. If you've never smelled the entrance to the hive or a kitchen full of fresh honey and wax, it's a treat.

Thanks all!

Rene

 

[girlishcharm2004]

I made a high water hot process soap, and it warped terribly. Although, some claim theirs don't warp even using water at 100%. Maybe I'm just doing something wrong.

The one time I used honey in a hot process batch, I added it after the cook. I didn't mix it all the way so it had golden brown swirls. I don't know how it would look if it were fully incorporated, in regards to your question if the soap would remain lighter in color. Besides pine tar and essential/fragrance oils, I haven't had much luck with scents of the ingredients remaining through the soap process -- even some essential/fragrance oil scents will be gone once the soap can be unmolded (now that is disappointing).

 

[doggonegardener]

It actually came out looking pretty good

I will try to post some pics later but it came out lighter than I expected and the pollen bits show up nicely.

Rene

 

[haksaktiawan]

I always add honey after cook my batch. I did HP and I just wont to cook honey...

Actually I dont know the advantage if I add honey after cook it. I just like the result. It mixed well and very moisturizing

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

Does it still increase the bubbles that way?

 

[Ruthie]

Does it still increase the bubbles that way?

That's what I was wondering.