CPOP or naw?

[nogud247]

Is there any reason I cannot CPOP a soap that's 80% OO and 20% CO? I have read that CO gets hot fast so I don't want a volcano or anything. It's my first soap ever but I ran the numbers through soapcalc and bramble berrys calc and it seems sound.

 

[shunt2011]

You can most certainly CPOP. You shouldn't have a problem with 20% CO. It's when you have 100% CO that can be an issue. Many CPOP, however, I've never had any luck with it personally. I ended up with issues no matter how I tried. So, I just insulate and let it go. Also, with 80% Olive you will need to give your soap a good long cure. If you have palm/lard available I would add a higher amount of those and drop your OO to 30% or so. You will get a nice hard creamy bar of soap. High OO can give a bit of a slimy feel sometimes.

Welcome to the forum! You may want to pop in to the introduction section and tell us a bit about yourself.

 

[Susie]

I never CPOP, I have issues every time. I have just given up on the whole concept. However, if you are thinking that you can skip cure by doing CPOP or HP, you can't. You still need 4-6 weeks cure for most soaps, and probably 4 months minimum for a soap that high in OO.

 

[nogud247]

Thank you for the prompt replies. I am not trying to avoid a cure so much as assure gel. I know that I can blanket it and hope but I'm just trying to assure it turns out. I might go get some other hard oil and reduce the OO as suggested. If I do so will I have a usable bar sooner? I need to make this and hopefully have some ready to sell mid September for a local charity. Again thanks for the advice and I will pop into the intro section later tonight.

 

[kumudini]

I use CPOP when I want to absolutely make sure that the soap gels. Gelled soaps give you sharper colors where as non gelled soaps have a creamy subdued look. Partial gel is something I'm not ready for. So I either insulate well/ CPOP. My HDPE molds have been really good for that. No glycerine rivers or bubbly tops or anything like that. I get minimal ash too. Silicone molds are different though, I always get bubbly tops and lots of ash.
Here is what I do. HDPE molds, I preheat the oven to the lowest setting which is 170 F, put the soap in. After one hour, turn the oven off but leave the soap in there. For silicone molds, I turn the oven off within 15 min and check for complete gel before taking the soap out.

 

[cmzaha]

Like Shari and Susie I almost always have some issue with cpop so I do not use that method. When I used to gel soap if it was a cold night I would put a heat pad underneath the mold to help along with gel. Now I put them in the freezer to stop gel. I know some say gelled soap gives brighter, sharper colors, I find with my colors it does not, and have always hated the colors my cpop, when I was playing with the method, turned out

 

[nogud247]

You can most certainly CPOP. You shouldn't have a problem with 20% CO. It's when you have 100% CO that can be an issue. Many CPOP, however, I've never had any luck with it personally. I ended up with issues no matter how I tried. So, I just insulate and let it go. Also, with 80% Olive you will need to give your soap a good long cure. If you have palm/lard available I would add a higher amount of those and drop your OO to 30% or so. You will get a nice hard creamy bar of soap. High OO can give a bit of a slimy feel sometimes.

Welcome to the forum! You may want to pop in to the introduction section and tell us a bit about yourself.

So if I do 50% lard/30% OO/ 20% CO do you think it would be a nice, hard, worthy of selling or giving away soap by September?

 

[kumudini]

Brighter colors or not, I dread partial gel for some reason, that's why I CPOP sometimes. And since I didn't have any issues except for the minor ones with silicone molds, I'll most likely continue to do that with my other molds. But I'm kind of wondering, what kind of issues could come up. Susie, Shunt or Carolyn, can you share the issues you had with the process so I can be on the lookout? May be I'm actually having issues and not seeing them as I'm not very experienced at this. I've only been soaping for about 9 months now.

 

[shunt2011]

Separation, overheating, volcanos, weird looking tops. Just a few things I had happen when I first started out. Now I just lay a couple towels around my mold and let it be. I have never had partial gel even with the air running and our room temp is 69.

 

[kumudini]

Those will be pretty obvious I think. So may be I was just lucky so far.
Btw, my last orange soap batch after pouring in the log mold I put the extra in the bug mold. I put the log mold in the oven and the bugs just in my window after covering with plastic. There definitely is a color difference. In this instance I like the bugs better as 1. they are bugs and 2. They have that creamy look to them with a smooth surface where as the cut bars are darker but nothing special about the color and all the damage to surface the dragging off of the knife caused.

 

[TeresaT]

So if I do 50% lard/30% OO/ 20% CO do you think it would be a nice, hard, worthy of selling or giving away soap by September?

In your original post you state "it's my first soap ever." So, NO, it will not be a soap worthy of selling by September. You might be able to give it to some close friends and family; however, selling or giving your "first soap ever" to strangers is inviting trouble. If you made a batch of soap today, it wouldn't be ready to use until September 17th at the soonest. And you'd have to test it, on yourself, first to make sure it was safe to use, before giving it to someone else.

 

[nogud247]

In your original post you state "it's my first soap ever." So, NO, it will not be a soap worthy of selling by September. You might be able to give it to some close friends and family; however, selling or giving your "first soap ever" to strangers is inviting trouble. If you made a batch of soap today, it wouldn't be ready to use until September 17th at the soonest. And you'd have to test it, on yourself, first to make sure it was safe to use, before giving it to someone else.

Awesome. Thank you. I fully understand. Now if I still do the lard OO co soap today in the previously mentioned ratios do you think it would be a nice soap to use at home?

 

[nogud247]

Also does nobody believe that if you do enough research and follow the science closely enough that it's possible to have good results out the gate?

 

[kumudini]

I don't use lard but going by what a lot of people on this forum have to say, your recipe would indeed make a good soap if everything goes well. That last part is where most mistakes happen with brand new soapers. You might have seen this other thread about no trace, we couldn't successfully troubleshoot it yet.

 

[coffeetime]

We all start out thinking soap is easy. But when most of us look back at our first batches, they are simply awful compared to what you'll be able to make a year or two later. Trust us: this is the whole 20/20 hindsight thing that we are trying to give to new soapers to spare them some trouble.

 

[The Efficacious Gentleman]

Also does nobody believe that if you do enough research and follow the science closely enough that it's possible to have good results out the gate?

The experience that would help you answer that is obviously lacking, which means that while the soap itself might be perfectly okay, you yourself are not in a position to give it further as you don't know in practice how it compares to other recipes and the actual practice of soap making. Theory is one thing, but not no matter how lucky you think you are, you still lack experience to back up the theory. Not to mention that you can research on some utterly terrible sources and your theory is actually garbage.

 

[kumudini]

Also does nobody believe that if you do enough research and follow the science closely enough that it's possible to have good results out the gate?

My first batch was good. Was it sellable? May be, but I can tell you that I make much better soaps now, every new recipe is a learning opportunity. All the studying in the world doesn't compare with hands on experience. R&D is a practical thing not theory. And, I wouldn't trust most of the internet sources or even books, anybody who thought they have something to say can put up a blog or publish a book these days.

 

[TeresaT]

Awesome. Thank you. I fully understand. Now if I still do the lard OO co soap today in the previously mentioned ratios do you think it would be a nice soap to use at home?

I would reduce the CO by 5% and make it castor oil to help stabilize the bubbles. However, the recipe as stated would make a nice bar of soap to use at home. And once you started using it, you could decide what you like (or don't) about it. Then you could tweak the recipe for the next time. Continue doing that until you have your perfect product.

 

[TeresaT]

Also does nobody believe that if you do enough research and follow the science closely enough that it's possible to have good results out the gate?

Nope. Not me. I've only been making soap since April. My first soaps were great. They made my skin feel great. My skin problems literally disappeared before my first bar of soap did. But soon after using them, my shower clogged up. Turns out I have hard water. Soap makes scum in hard water. Did your research tell you that? Mine sure as heck did not! I had to buy a huge bottle of drain cleaner and a snake to clean out the shower drain. Then I discovered what a "chelant" is and how to use it. Now, I add it to all of my soaps. However, I still have 4 months worth of soaps that do not have a chelant in them. So, I have to warn my "testers" that the soap will cause scum if they have hard water. I also tell them only use the soap a few times to get an idea of how it lathers, makes their skin feel, etc., and then toss it. I don't want to knowingly be responsible for a bunch of bad plumbing. So, all the research I did before I ever made my first batch of soap did not prepare me for the real world of soap. Sorry. I don't mean to sound mean or argumentative, but think about it, did what you learned in high school really prepare you for life? No different with learning about soap vs making soap.

 

[nogud247]

Nope. Not me. I've only been making soap since April. My first soaps were great. They made my skin feel great. My skin problems literally disappeared before my first bar of soap did. But soon after using them, my shower clogged up. Turns out I have hard water. Soap makes scum in hard water. Did your research tell you that? Mine sure as heck did not! I had to buy a huge bottle of drain cleaner and a snake to clean out the shower drain. Then I discovered what a "chelant" is and how to use it. Now, I add it to all of my soaps. However, I still have 4 months worth of soaps that do not have a chelant in them. So, I have to warn my "testers" that the soap will cause scum if they have hard water. I also tell them only use the soap a few times to get an idea of how it lathers, makes their skin feel, etc., and then toss it. I don't want to knowingly be responsible for a bunch of bad plumbing. So, all the research I did before I ever made my first batch of soap did not prepare me for the real world of soap. Sorry. I don't mean to sound mean or argumentative, but think about it, did what you learned in high school really prepare you for life? No different with learning about soap vs making soap.

Yes my research did. I believe some people use citric acid or something to help combat it? I'll gain the knowledge hands on as suggested. Thanks to all that replied.