Conditioning Bath Soap - does this look okay?

[Flyrod77]

This would be a hot process soap I would like to make as a bath conditioning bar soap. I used these oils in a conditioning shaving soap that I really like (but that shaving recipe had high stearic acid added).

1. I would love to have some feedback on this before I make it. Does it look reasonable?
2. Would this produce a bar that is too soft? I'm new at this and wondered about it.

Thank you very much for any help you can give to me. My first attempt to make soap was the shaving soap and (thanks to people's input) it ended up being very good. Now I'm trying for the bath soap version

 

[Susie]

Hi, Dave!

Please be really sure you want real critique before reading the rest of my reply! You have been warned!

Too much coconut oil- drop it to 15%
Too much castor oil- drop it to 5%
Drop the shea butter to 15%
You have way too many oils. You should have max 4-5 oils. I would use CO, castor oil, OO, and no more than two others.

Is there some reason you are avoiding tallow, lard, or palm oils? They really play an important role in soap. I would add all the balance of what you just removed to the lard, tallow, or palm.

You might want to try something more like this:

Lard/tallow/palm oil (NOT palm kernel oil) 65%
Olive Oil 15%
Coconut Oil 15%
Castor Oil 5%

Superfat 5%

I would use the recipe above as a starting place, make one batch.

Then, use ONE of the other oils at 5-10% in one batch. Repeat with the other oils one new oil to one batch. You may want to color them different colors to differentiate.

Wait 4-6 weeks. Try each batch and make notes on whether you like that or not. Compare all of them to the original batch.

Let us know what you think, then we can steer you better.

 

[lenarenee]

Hi Dave,

I would skip the addition of glycerin; saponification results in glycerin already.

I'm just going to clarify Susie's advice a little:

25% coconut is higher than what many of us use; but won't "break" the soap.

Meadow foam is an expensive soap and you're welcome to use it in your soap, but there's no need to. Many people save it for leave-on products.

There's nothing wrong with using many oils in a recipe- feel free to experiment. But I for one, (and there are quite a few others) have found that simpler is just as good or better. My personal preference would be to use either the avocado or the sunflower, but not both. At that percentage they're benefits aren't really noticeable.

I can't speak to the shea butter; I've never used it as a hard oil in my recipe.

Good luck and enjoy!

 

[Flyrod77]

Hi, Dave!

Please be really sure you want real critique before reading the rest of my reply! You have been warned!

Too much coconut oil- drop it to 15%
Too much castor oil- drop it to 5%
Drop the shea butter to 15%
You have way too many oils. You should have max 4-5 oils. I would use CO, castor oil, OO, and no more than two others.

Is there some reason you are avoiding tallow, lard, or palm oils? They really play an important role in soap. I would add all the balance of what you just removed to the lard, tallow, or palm.

You might want to try something more like this:

Lard/tallow/palm oil (NOT palm kernel oil) 65%
Olive Oil 15%
Coconut Oil 15%
Castor Oil 5%

Superfat 5%

I would use the recipe above as a starting place, make one batch.

Then, use ONE of the other oils at 5-10% in one batch. Repeat with the other oils one new oil to one batch. You may want to color them different colors to differentiate.

Wait 4-6 weeks. Try each batch and make notes on whether you like that or not. Compare all of them to the original batch.

Let us know what you think, then we can steer you better.

Thanks for the help. I was hoping to do a vegan recipe, and no palm oil. I should have said that in my original post.

 

[Nevada]

Soap is meant to cleanse, well-made hand-crafted soap cleanses gently. If still drying use skin-softening lotions.
Suggestion:
Coconut 20%
EVOO 80%
SF 6%

 

[Cellador]

I have made a couple of no palm, vegan recipes. The ones I like best have included another butter like cocoa butter or mango butter (or both). I do find that these, along with the higher percentage of liquid oils, off-set the cleansing factor of a higher coconut oil percentage and still allow for a bar that will cure in 6-8 weeks. Of course, just my opinion....
I would reduce the castor to 5% though.

 

[Cindy2428]

Dave, I agree with the others in lowering the coco oil and keeping castor below 10%. I also would suggest subbing some/all of your water with coconut milk. It adds that extra conditioning factor in my opinion. For simplicity, make 50% of your liquid coconut, rice, oat milk (whatever). Pour that in with your melted oils. Mix your lye with the other 50% water. Very easy this way.

 

[Arimara]

I suggest cutting out the meadowfoam (it's better in lotion) and adding that to the avocado oil, lowering the castor oil to about 5-7%, and leaving out the glycerin. Your recipe might turn out awfully sticky as is.

 

[SoapAddict415]

Experiment & have fun! At the end of the day it's about what YOU like. I usually use castor at 6-8% and coconut at 22% in every recipe. To me, my bars aren't sticky or too drying. If you really want to use an expensive oil I'd suggest doing a small batch (8 oz oils) with it & a small batch without it and compare the 2 to see what you like. I say this because I've been told to save expensive butters for leave on applications but my skin actually likes​some of the soaps I've made with them.

 

[lsg]

I use a higher amount of coconut oil than many people. I use as much as 30% in some of my bars, with a higher superfat value. Having said that, a low cleansing number will help give you a soap that doesn't strip the skin of its protective layer of oils.

 

[Flyrod77]

Dave, I agree with the others in lowering the coco oil and keeping castor below 10%. I also would suggest subbing some/all of your water with coconut milk. It adds that extra conditioning factor in my opinion. For simplicity, make 50% of your liquid coconut, rice, oat milk (whatever). Pour that in with your melted oils. Mix your lye with the other 50% water. Very easy this way.

I like your suggestion, a lot. I am going to try this.

 

[Flyrod77]

Thanks to everyone in this thread who helped me. I will redo the recipe in light of these good suggestions. I deeply appreciate everyone's help.

 

[cmzaha]

Please nix the meadowfoam and save it for a nice leave on balm. You really do not want to wash it down the drain. It is also nice in lip balm. I cannot help you with a vegan recipe since I will not make a vegan soap without palm, but yes you will need a hard butter to help with a less soluble bar. I would lower the coconut to the 15% but I am not a big fan of lots of CO and apparently my customers are not either

 

[Kittish]

I've made almost that exact recipe you came up with, but with only 5% castor and no sunflower oil. And without adding additional glycerin. It made a very nice soap. It's the favorite of my niece and nephew (though I suspect the bright colors of the soap has more to do with that). I, for one, like meadowfoam oil in soap. Yes, it's kind of on the expensive side but it adds a lovely feeling to the lather.

 

[Flyrod77]

After reading the suggestions here I made some changes to the original recipe and made the soap over the weekend. As suggested, I didn't use added glycerin. I lowered the Coconut oil, raised the Olive oil, lowered the Castor oil, and regarding the Meadowfoam oil, I took it out of the HP oils, but added a bit (2%) at the end (with the fragrance oil) for superfatting.

If nothing else, hopefully, I will learn something from this and can adjust my next recipe accordingly.

 

[penelopejane]

It will be interesting to compare it to your next soap.

I find that I can't notice the difference if an oil is <10%.
Except for castor which I use at 5% as it makes a softer bar if it is at a higher rate in my recipes.
Personally I prefer less coconut oil - or none - but I know a lot of guys like it at high levels as it leaves your skin feeling squeaky clean.

 

[Cindy2428]

I think you have a solid recipe there. I agree with Penelope; most oils you can't tell a difference at 5%. Exceptions would be waxes like lanolin or beeswax, etc. I don't think you will be disappointed with this batch.

As a comparison however; for your next batch split the olive and HO sunflower at 20% each.

Are you going to use milk?

 

[Flyrod77]

It will be interesting to compare it to your next soap.

I find that I can't notice the difference if an oil is <10%.
Except for castor which I use at 5% as it makes a softer bar if it is at a higher rate in my recipes.
Personally I prefer less coconut oil - or none - but I know a lot of guys like it at high levels as it leaves your skin feeling squeaky clean.

I am really curious how it turns out. I used these same oils (but at different percentages) in a shaving soap. I have to laugh, because I like the shaving soap so much I'd almost be tempted to use is as a bath soap - I just love how my skin feels after I use it. LOL, but it seems a bit weird to use shaving soap in the shower

Anyway, this is my attempt to have a bath soap with the same oils - minus the shaving soap recipe's stearic acid. It seems a bit like some mad scientist chemistry experiment

 

[Flyrod77]

I think you have a solid recipe there. I agree with Penelope; most oils you can't tell a difference at 5%. Exceptions would be waxes like lanolin or beeswax, etc. I don't think you will be disappointed with this batch.

As a comparison however; for your next batch split the olive and HO sunflower at 20% each.

Are you going to use milk?

I didn't use milk this time. I was intrigued with the suggestion to use 50/50 water and coconut milk, but I thought I'd better try this recipe first with water and then adjust from that experience.

I can see how this soap making could become addictive

 

[Cindy2428]

Oh Dave you are in trouble........ You have found the perfect group of enablers here.