burst my bubble....

[WilsonFamilyPicnic]

i had a batch that just finished curing and i gave it to my mom...actually, i put it in her tub and told her to try it out....she said it was kind of drying to her skin!!! argh!!!!!

That had numbers
hardness 44
cleansing 20
conditioning 52
bubbly 25
creamy 28

so, i fiddled and fiddled and came up with...
hardness 37
cleansing 16
conditioning 59
bubbly 21
creamy 25


is that going to be a way soft bar?? so frustrating...conditioning goes up hardness goes down..... why can't i have the best of both worlds?

 

[Guest]

What oils are you using?

 

[WilsonFamilyPicnic]

coco 15%
olive 38%
palm 24%
pko 10%
castor 5%
canola 8%

 

[Lane]

That had numbers
hardness 44
cleansing 20
conditioning 52
bubbly 25
creamy 28

Well I think those look like really good numbers! Maybe you need to superfat a bit more?

My numbers are
Hd 46
Cl 22
Con 49
Bub 30
Crm 31

But I use high amounts of Shea and Avocado oil, which have bunches of UNsaponifyables (sp?) and I SF at 6%

 

[Barb]

despite what shows up on the soap calc this should be a hard bar because of the high amount of olive.

i don't think it takes into account that olive produces a hard bar, it might take it awhile but it will be hard.

your mom's skin being on the mature side (sorry mom), may need more linolenic acids , switch out the canola for soybean, this increases it from an 8 to 11 . younger skin types will do ok with soaps that are higher in olenic.

i not only look at the cleansing, hardness, conditioning factors but also the fatty acids.

i like my personal soaps to have at least a 15 linolenic. oils that are high in this are oils like soybean, evening primrose and high linelenic sunflower and safflower oils.

these are more pershiable oils but you do not need them in high amounts to acheive the conditioning.

barb

 

[WilsonFamilyPicnic]

that is really interesting barb! not something i had thought about when looking at oils. something new for me to learn about!

i think i am going to make this batch, but then i'm going to play around with the evening primrose....i have some in the fridge that needs to be used up relatively soon!

 

[Barb]

http://www.ecauldron.com/articles/archi ... try_11.php

this is a good article

barb

 

[NEASoapWorks]

your mom's skin being on the mature side (sorry mom), may need more linolenic acids , switch out the canola for soybean, this increases it from an 8 to 11 . younger skin types will do ok with soaps that are higher in olenic.

i not only look at the cleansing, hardness, conditioning factors but also the fatty acids.

i like my personal soaps to have at least a 15 linolenic. oils that are high in this are oils like soybean, evening primrose and high linelenic sunflower and safflower oils.

these are more pershiable oils but you do not need them in high amounts to acheive the conditioning.

barb

Barb,

Thanks SO much for this! It's very, very helpful. I'm 45, but I still do well with high oleic soaps. But I need to consider this, when formulating a standard recipe, when I decide to sell.

 

[Birdie]

... i not only look at the cleansing, hardness, conditioning factors but also the fatty acids...
(emphasis mine)

OMG! A soapmaker after my own heart!!! :wink:

 

[Barb]

your're welcome

wish i was brainy enough to say i fiqured this one out on my own, but alas i did not. another soaper shared this with me so it is only appropriate i pay it forward.

plus i'm a chart freak, and have tons of them listing the properties of the various oils. & i'm always googling for new ones and articles pertaining to soap making. soapmaking is always an ongoing education for me.

i've been known to call companies wanting to know why i can't find sunflower oil on my grocery store shelfs any longer. one day i got the bright idea to call walmart and find out the exact percentages of animal and soy in their great value animal shortening. ( it's 96% animal mostly lard and 4 % soybean by the way, lol ), the chemist was pretty cool about the whole thing, it wasn't some great mystery that they had to guard with their lives afterall.

the only dumb question is one that isn't ever asked.

barb

 

[Soapmaker Man]

I agree! You totally start to understand the "hows and whys" of building a great recipe by learning how the oils, fats and butters work together to compliment each other. Once you learn the "synergy" of the sum of oils you have chosen for their specific qualities, then you are starting to become a true soap professional. Olive oil will get as hard as a brick, it may take a few months, but I consider OO as a hard oil. As long as you let the soap cure at least 6 weeks, or more, OO will indeed make a harder bar. I like looking at the fatty acids profile too. That is why I love soapcalc.com. It has taught me over the years, combined with testing, what I need to include in my recipe and then tweaked the % of those oils to get the recipe I'm using today.

Paul

 

[WilsonFamilyPicnic]

Thanks Barb, that was a really good article! very much appreciated!

I have another question for you....i was searching around the past couple of days looking for some information about the astringency of carrier oils. Have you ever run across a good article about that?

 

[WilsonFamilyPicnic]

mom's skin update: i gave her a bar of soap that was the exact same recipe as the one she said was a little drying to her skin except this one was made with goat's milk and she gave it a big thumbs up! so, goat's milk is pure liquid magic....

 

[seaysoap]

Thanks Barb-Great Article

It seems the more I read about soap making, the more confused I get. For the most part I use the same recipe (OO 50%, CO 35% SyO 15%) It seems to do well. This part of the year I do add sunflower or Vit E oil to it. I tell you all what though, I am intimidated by yalls knowledge of soap making.

 

[Lane]

Re: Thanks Barb-Great Article

It seems the more I read about soap making, the more confused I get. For the most part I use the same recipe (OO 50%, CO 35% SyO 15%) It seems to do well. This part of the year I do add sunflower or Vit E oil to it. I tell you all what though, I am intimidated by yalls knowledge of soap making.

Confusion is key!! That's how you figure it all out! If it was easy, simple and black & white, we wouldn't all strive to make it better

 

[CPSoaper]

Re: Thanks Barb-Great Article

It seems the more I read about soap making, the more confused I get. For the most part I use the same recipe (OO 50%, CO 35% SyO 15%) It seems to do well. This part of the year I do add sunflower or Vit E oil to it. I tell you all what though, I am intimidated by yalls knowledge of soap making.

What is nice or works for one person, may not be what works for the next. For instance, some people can use higher amounts of coconut oil in their soap recipes with no problems while for others, coconut oil can be drying to their skin. Now castile soaps are considered one of the most gentle type soaps and yet on my skin, unless given a long, long cure, they can be drying. It is all part of the fun process to figure a recipe out that produces a bar of soap with the qualities you desire.