Another dumb eo question

[Martin]

I am sure this has been asked before, so please bear with me. When you say you use .5oz ppo of eo can you add some to oil to help stretch it out? I have a .5 bottle of lemon grass and want to make 2lbs. I guess my question is can I add it to some oil to make last longer?

Sonja

 

[Guest]

I'm a newbie but I think I can answer your question because I'm facing a similar issue.

In short: NO

Your EO is the essence of the aroma. Adding something with no aroma to that is not going to make more aroma. You can do only two things: (1) use more EO, or (2) make a smaller batch.

Yesterday I did my first batch, 1 fl. oz. tangerine EO to 3 lbs of oil, and I can barely detect the scent in the completed soap.

I've got some lemongrass here and might even use it today, 1 fl. oz., and to my sense of smell it's about the same strength as the tangerine I used yesterday. I know for sure that the 1 oz. lemongrass won't put any usable scent in today's batch, so I'm going to cut the batch size down because I don't want to buy more EO at the price I paid at the nutrition store. In fact I have to order EOs today on the Internet so I can get a better, non-ripoff price.

So either get more EO or make a smaller batch. Your 0.5 won't do it.


EDIT:

I should have mentioned, I'm using NOW brand. YMMV

Just to be thorough, you have three problems: not enough scent (IMO), lye, heat. That's presuming you're using CP. You might lower the lye by picking low SAP oils, you might be able to add the EO at a cooler stage, but I doubt you would be able to make more than a minuscule change and you might chunk your batter before it goes in the mold. If you can't get more EO and won't reduce your batch size, then you can divide your batch and scent only part of it.

 

[Martin]

Thanks for the info. I'll do a one pound batch instead.

Sonja

 

[Guest]

Again, let me remind you I'm a newbie, so I hope the soapmaking gods don't stomp on my tail.

Please tell how it works out for you Sonja.

So far I've done one batch and the scenting is the only part that failed. I've decided to do twice the scent, put my 1 fl. oz. in 1.5 pounds of oil instead of in 3 pounds of oil.

We're both exploring the same area and perhaps we can learn from each other.

Greg

 

[Martin]

I have made 5 batches so far, all unscented. I have a friend that works at a health food store that gave me a couple of .5 bottles of eos. I about died when I saw the price tag :shock: :shock: :shock: I have no nose for scents and don't want to waste them. I figured lemongrass I could use by itself. I hear people on here say that they add 3 to 4 oz when making big batches of soap. Don't see how any one can afford it.

Sonja

 

[itsmeroro]

Again, let me remind you I'm a newbie, so I hope the soapmaking gods don't stomp on my tail. Greg

Its not that kind of place... they are all really nice and super helpful here. Sort of refreshing.

Cheers!

 

[dragonfly princess]

Again, let me remind you I'm a newbie, so I hope the soapmaking gods don't stomp on my tail. Greg

Its not that kind of place... they are all really nice and super helpful here. Sort of refreshing.

Cheers!

Yes it is!!! Put that tail out there cuz here comes the foot!!!! :twisted:

Just kidding! Why don't you all try some fragrance oils, they are a little cheaper! Just a thought

 

[Guest]

Its not that kind of place...

Yes it is!!! Put that tail out there cuz here comes the foot!!!! :twisted:

LOL! You're beginning to make me as nervous as a cat in a rocking chair factory!

Well sometimes my enthusiasm carries me away. I just started reading up on soaping earlier this month, and I read soaping and googled soaping so much that I've got soap coming out of my ears. I've gained all this knowledge but little practical experience, so I'm eager to test my knowledge by solving real world problems, or trying to.

Sonja, what does that lemongrass sell for? I bought 1 fl. oz. of NOW lemongrass EO for $4.79 at an independent nutrition store. I thought it a little expensive, but not horribly so. On a per bar basis it cost me about 30 cents extra over unscented. It may seem like a lot but my per bar cost was still under $1 while similar store bars cost $4-$6 (like at Whole Foods Market).


What are the important differences between fragrance oils and EOs? Are the FOs natural like the EOs? I prefer to stick with natural instead of synthetic, but I too find the cost of the EOs to be a bit excessive.

 

[Martin]

The lemongrass is from Nutrition World Aura Cacia brand and for .5oz is $5.29 and wild chamomile is $29.99 for .5 oz :shock: :shock: Is chamomile that good in soap?

Sonja

 

[Guest]

Well that lemongrass isn't a very good price, more than twice what I paid. And I expect the chamomile is not priced for how good it is but rather how much it costs to produce. But you probably meant was it worth that much to use it. I don't know, but it's too pricey for me.

 

[cdwinsby]

Remember that each eo is different. Half an oz. of sweet orange won't give nearly as much scent as the same amount of lemongrass. Take clove for example. When I want to add clove I only put about a quarter the amount I would of some other oils.

Where you get your eo's makes a difference as well. The same named oil will smell stronger from one supplier compared to the other.

Health food stores are your most expensive place to buy eo's from I think. I'm guilty of buying from them myself . Especially when I get impatient to make a particular scented bar.

Here are a couple of links to some online suppliers that have fairly decent prices.
http://www.mountainroseherbs.com/index2.html - US Company
http://www.newdirectionsaromatics.com/ - US and Canada
http://www.kwspecialties.on.ca/ - Canada

Cathy

 

[Guest]

Thanks Cathy. I'll check out those suppliers.

I hope I didn't go overboard, but it'll be a good lesson if I can't use my soap. I hit it with about 2/3 fl. oz. lemongrass ppo. It seemed like the right thing to do, and the batch was small and not very expensive oils, so it won't hurt too bad if it's overscented. My last batch didn't have almost any scent at all...

How's that Canadian supplier for sending stuff into the US, and do you know if their prices are Canadian or US dollars?

 

[Guest]

Hey Cathy, that Mountain Rose Herbs didn't have such good prices but New Directions Aromatics did. I cruised their price lists and checked a few comps, and NDA came out the winner. I also noticed that the EOs don't get affordable until you get up into the 1# area. NDA has sweet orange for about $20/lb at 33.3 oz. level, where MRH has it for $67/lb in 16 oz. size (their biggest size). Woah, NDA goes all the way up to 400# for $2K!!! ($5/lb)

So probably the best idea is to buy it at a nutrition store until you find a scent you like, then buy at least a pound or more online.


I didn't check out KW Specialties because they're in Canada and I don't know how they are for sending stuff to the US (in terms of expense).

 

[Woodi]

I buy many eo's from ND, and usually in the 1 or 2 pound sizes. It's much more economical that way, and allows me to be generous with the scent in each batch. I do use 1/2 oz ppo for most, except peppermint, clove or cinnamon. Those are much stronger and you can get away with less.

another way you can use less scent is by doing HP (hot process) soapmaking.....which means you take your recipe to trace, as in CP, then put it into a pot and cook it. Add the scent only after the cook and you can use much less than with CP.

My fav HP method is to use a stainless steel pot, and put it into the oven at 220 degree, stirring every 15 mins or so. It is fun to see the various stages. Once the soap is gelled, you can use it in a day....another benefit of HP. It does look lumpier than CP though.

 

[Martin]

I just found this site www.betweenfriendstoo.com any one ever order from them? They seem to have good prices.

Sonja

 

[Guest]

another way you can use less scent is by doing HP (hot process) soapmaking.....which means you take your recipe to trace, as in CP, then put it into a pot and cook it. Add the scent only after the cook and you can use much less than with CP.

My fav HP method is to use a stainless steel pot, and put it into the oven at 220 degree, stirring every 15 mins or so. It is fun to see the various stages. Once the soap is gelled, you can use it in a day....another benefit of HP. It does look lumpier than CP though.

Sounds like a good idea. I presume the HP avoids the lye degradation of the EO.

That "looks lumpier," is that just while you're cooking it, while your putting it into the mold, or the end product?

 

[Martin]

I went ahead a made a 2lb batch with lemongrass and lemon. Just put it to bed. See what happens.

Sonja

 

[jadiebugs1]

Just my 2cents worth, but it's my understanding that citrus EOs don't hold up as well in CP soap making. The only experience I have with EOs is Anise, Lavender, Peppermint,and Orange EOs. I used a LOT of Orange and a little peppermint in my tooth soap, I can barely taste the orange and can definetely taste/smell the peppermint. Just another reason I prefer a GOOD FO to EOs and they usually cost a lot less.

Again, just my 2cents for what it's worth.

(I'm actually trying to quit smoking right now...it's been 31 hours! but the only time I'm not trying to stuff something in my mouth is when I'm typing and thinking soap!)

 

[Guest]

(I'm actually trying to quit smoking right now...it's been 31 hours! but the only time I'm not trying to stuff something in my mouth is when I'm typing and thinking soap!)

Omfg, I'm so sorry. I hope you succeed! I just helped a friend off of the bad weed and she seems to be succeeding after maybe 4 months. I don't know if SMF has a social area (I'll look) but I'll be glad to support you with encouragement and advice.

I'm about 30 years after quitting, and 12 years before that of smoking. I don't miss it a bit now.