4 soaps tested and don't like any of them.. help.

[jenneelk]

Ok so the first two were rebatch from BB that I started with to get my feet wet. No real changes to the batches and added just a small bit of oil which the allow for.

I can't tell if I'm getting a zap or not with them. They do taste quite bitter.
My problem with all of them is this 'film' feel that I get after rinsing. I'm used to using liquid soaps and 'dial' clear brand. No fancy Dove or anything.. just off brand liquid dial soap. I thought before that the rebatch was just not my liking but now I don't like these either.

Here are the 2 batches I made 4 weeks ago.. one is higher cocoa butter at 24% but all my numbers are within a good range. 5% superfat
hardness: 45
cleansing: 14
conditioning: 52
bubbly: 23
creamy: 40
iodine: 54
INS: 155

Next one is a goats milk and little higher cleansing but did have a low fat goats milk and 5% superfat. Mix of CO, OO, Lard, castor (10% which I don't do anymore) and shea and cocoa butter are just 8% each. Maybe that's the problem here?

hardness: 40
cleansing: 17
conditioning: 56
bubbly: 26
creamy: 32
Iodine: 57
INS: 152

 

[sistrum]

I know I probably sound like a broken record but those numbers don't really mean anything. In order to help we will need to know what went into each soap and how much. Are these the first of your soaps that you have tried? Maybe you're just not use to the feel yet? You might like a lower super fat. Did both batches have lard in them? How much olive oil are you using? Some fats and oils can have an after feel like you described but you may just not be used to all the oils not being stripped from your skin. that can happen with commercial cleansers. Sorry not much help.

 

[new12soap]

How old are they? Did you let them cure? I like to let soap cure for at least 6 weeks, to me 8 is better.

You may as pp said just not be used to not having all your natural moisture be stripped from your skin, or because natural soaps don't have rinsing agents in them it may feel different.

Personally I prefer soaps with a much lower cleansing value, but again, those numbers are just rough guidelines.

 

[jenneelk]

ok here is the recipes
first one is
cocoa butter 24%
OO 15%
CO 20%
OO 15%
palm 18%
crisco 10%
almond 3%
castor 10%

and I don't use this many ingredients anymore... just too many but seemed like nice balance

Next one
CO 25%
OO 35%
Castor 10%
Cocoa butter 8%
Shea butter 8%
Lard 14%

all the water was changed out for low fat goats milk I froze
also had 3TBS coconut milk powder at light trace.

and maybe it is just the difference between this and commerical. The application is great, creamy and lots of bubbles but after rinsing I feel tacky and there is no glide, not that I want slippery, but it's basically sticky bumpy when I run my hands down my arms in the water.
both cured for 4 weeks now.. but would 2 weeks change this kind of property of the soap?

 

[CaraCara]

Is your water softened? I find that the soap has a different feel with softened hard water than with regular 'city' water. I was on a business trip recently and found that my soaps rinsed quite cleanly using city water. At home it feels more slippery, as DH comments. The only thing I can attribute a sticky feel to would be maybe the butters?

 

[Obsidian]

The first time I used my soaps was around 4 weeks and I didn't care much for the feel either. Left a weird icky feeling like I wasn't clean. Now its been almost 2 months and they feel a lot better, I'm also getting used to the feeling of CP soap which is different then store bough bar soap.
Give you bars another month or two then try, I bet they feel better.

 

[Obsidian]

Thats good advice too. My favorite soaps are 100% pure castile aged for a year (I had to buy some, mine won't be ready for a long time) and 100% lard with no scents or colors. I didn't like the lard at first, it left a really nasty film but now it feels great. Its creamy, slippery and gentle plus its hard enough I could probably beat a burglar into submission with a bar

 

[cerelife]

Just curious...have you used others' CP soap before and liked it, but just don't like yours? I know this seems like a silly question, but I only ask as you mentioned you normally use commercial.
CP soap feels totally different on your skin. Like others' mentioned, it doesn't leave your skin "squeaky-clean"...i.e. robbed of all its natural moisture.
We've used nothing but CP soap for several years and the few times we HAVE used commercial soap (forgot to pack some and had to use the hotel stuff), both my DH and I had dry, itchy alligator skin!
As to the "slip"/glide issue...some things I've learned both on here and from experience are that the older my soap is, the better slip it has, some additives seem to help (silk, clay), and using a wavy cutter helps as well!
BTW, I SF between 8-10%, but use a far smaller percentage of butter.
Hope this helps!

 

[jenneelk]

My water isn't soft... we figured that out quick when cloth diapering.
I have several other bars curing also and one is more basic with just CO, OO and I think Palm. All the other bars but these two are 7%+ superfat also.
I'll wait a few more weeks and see how these do and will try one of the basic bars soon also, think they are only at 3 weeks cure.

I've not tried another CP bars lately, have in the past from craft shows but it's been a while. Etsy I know has a bunch so I'm going to order from someone on there to try one out and compare.
thanks for all the help.. its quite discouraging. They felt SO SO nice going on that I was surprise at the after affect. Although I will say that once I dried off it wasn't a huge issue. No major differences.

I just got Kaolin clay and have started using that which sounds like it was a good move. And my butters were already cut to 10% total on the recipes after these. Maybe the rest will be good and these while they seemed good, are not.

 

[DeeAnna]

"...I can't tell if I'm getting a zap or not with them. They do taste quite bitter...."

If you have to wonder, then by definition your soap isn't zappy. Trust me on that one. You will unmistakably know a zap when you get it -- it's a harsh, sharp "bite" that you cannot avoid reacting to as if you're a 3-year-old eating a very, very sour dill pickle.

Some non-zappy soap doesn't have much taste at all to my tongue. Other non-zappy soap has a salty, slightly metallic flavor that I don't really care for, but it's more of a "meh, don't like that so much" feeling about it.

"...My water isn't soft... we figured that out quick when cloth diapering...."

If you have moderately to very hard water, a true soap will leave a sticky film on your skin that can be unpleasant. This film is created when the calcium or magnesium in your hard water reacts with your sodium soap to make an insoluble type of soap. This insoluble scum doesn't rinse off -- it remains on your skin and shower or bathtub.

A true soap in slightly hard or soft water can leave a "non squeaky clean" feeling that seems odd to someone who is used to a detergent cleanser. As others have explained, that is the feeling of skin that has not been stripped of its oils.

 

[CrafterAl]

I echo juiceman's comments.

A properly made soap using just 3 oils is hard to beat.

Adding all sorts of other ingredients adds to complexity and introduces all sorts of variables. Many variables in the soap makes it more difficult to make changes to improve on your result.

As is also suggested, even a 1 oil soap can be very good.

 

[jenneelk]

DeeAnna it is almost metallic maybe.. I tested the PH with some strips I believe I got from WSP and it was an 8 so not ideal at 7 but good for use.
And I went ahead and tested my water with my aquarium strips that have a harness on there and ours is right between soft and hard.. didn't really match either but closest to soft which is a surprise. We did move 2 years ago but nearby and the water quality seems the same.

I bought 2 bars from Etsy that didn't have other stuff in them that I wouldn't have in mine.

Its been about 3 weeks for my basic bars and think I might test the PH on one and try it out if it's not over 8.

 

[CrafterAl]

I'm quite sure that a ph strip is not accurate enough, when used on soap lather, to consistently tell a 7 ph from an 8 ph.

This link: http://www.soap-made-easy.com/soap-ph.html has some information on that idea.

We have a neighbor who was at one time a technical consultant to the SoapMakers Guild. I made a remark about checking soap ph to him.

He asked me how I did that.

I thought, "uh oh."

I stammered out something about ph strips. He said he hadn't figured out a good way to test soap ph yet! You can rest assured he knew about ph strips too!

That was several years ago and he may have sorted it out by now.

But ph strips likely isn't it.

 

[jenneelk]

Ok. There is a clear difference between 7 and 8 which I can see when testing plain tap water and the soap. They both match the color guide.
But 8 and 9 aren't as different and harder to differentiate.

Ill wait longer and also wait to get my bars from etsy to compare.

 

[DeeAnna]

"...tested the PH with some strips I believe I got from WSP and it was an 8 so not ideal at 7 but good for use. ..."

By definition, the pH of a sodium soap cannot be a 7. It is not possible to get the pH much below 8 without the soap breaking down chemically and many soaps will test between 8 and 10.

The bottom line of a long story is this: Don't get hung up on the pH number if you are determined to use the test strips. They are not accurate, but they will give a trend. Just be consistent with your measurement method and learn what they will show when the soap is safe and when it's not.

 

[jenneelk]

Ok sorry.. I just know people have mentioned using them and I had them here so have it a shot to have some insight. I had not heard before that they were not a good thing to use. Guess mine were fine then at 8 or so but it seems that doesn't matter. Lol
Appreciate the help. This info is good to know for the future.

Ph strips head to the garbage.

 

[heartsong]

just a thought jennee, are you using tap water or distilled water to make your soap? some people might think it's a bit nit-picky, but it's something to think about...I buy a couple gallons of distilled not just bottled water when i'm at the store...I used to live in southern California and the Bay Area, so I know how awful the tap water can be.

my other question is how does M&P or glycerine soap feel on your skin after your shower?

btw, if you message me your addy, i'll send you a bar of my "nuthin' fancy" whipped soap the next time I get home...at least you'll have something to compare with...my old hide loves this soap.

 

[DeeAnna]

"...Ok sorry.. I just know people have mentioned using them and I had them here so have it a shot to have some insight...."

Don't feel you have to apologize even one tiny bit ... you ask good questions, you are the kind of person who really wants to understand, and you take what works for you and use it. Kudos to you!

 

[roseb]

my recommendation to anyone not happy with their results is to make a small batch of simple soap. Nothing fancy.. no colors.. no fragrance.. no milks, clays, cocoa powder, shredded coconut, diatomaceous earth, sea monkeys, etc... see how you like that and expand from there...

https://summerbeemeadow.com/content/classic-3-oils-soap-recipe

I reference wholesalesuppliesplus for usage rates.. they have usage rates for most things... for example cocoa butter:
Recommended use levels:

Cold & Hot Process Soaps: 3-5% Lotions: 3-100% Lip Products 5-100%

Sea monkeys!!! ROTFL

 

[kharmon320]

Just wanted to chime in and say that I don't think I care for soaps made with coconut milk or heavy on the butters. I just recently made another batch using cocoa butter and coconut milk (to see what I thought), but at 6 weeks I'm not loving the lather. It's very creamy but just not the feel I'm going for. I like the soap made with milks (cow, goat, etc.), but have only used coconut milk a couple of times. I used to add shea butter to all my soaps, but discovered that I much preferred a recipe without shea.